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Whining

I totally agree with your method and I'm sure my consistent/persistent was the major fail during her first year. I can't recall when I introduced the e-collar but by the time I did she was at least 8 - 9 months old I think and the whining had been going on since day one - mostly for being confined, whether the crate, x-pen, even the fenced yard if I went outside the yard to the big acres to do chores without her she'd whine big time. I went by the ol' rules of not giving in/waiting it out for the most part, which I think probably enhanced the self-rewarding behavior. When she was older, pressure from the e-collar did nothing and I finally quit trying because I think I was sending confusing message that her down was being punished. I felt like I could never make it clear what she was doing wrong! I also worked on pairing it with "quiet" like I did with explosive barking, which did stop the barking, but never worked for the whining.... All in all I think the critical time is the first year and as you say extremely consistent, every time, every day, which admittedly I failed to do. Thanks for your input!
Idk @Ravenbird…if you were able to use “quiet” to stop barking and she understands this, then I think you have a good shot at using “quiet” for whining. Especially since you are so diligent with your training. Then if she stops whining after the command quiet, then reward the non whining. That’s a pretty good win-win right there.
 
Whining is a form of communication. Dobermans are simply known for being vocal. Its inherent. I've found the whining is USUALLY for a good reason; out of water, potty, pain, need more mental stimulation, blanket pulled over them...:rolleyes: If their needs are truly all met, and the whining doesn't stop with a quiet or "go lay down" to settle which usually this does the trick, then they get put in their kennel to settle for a nap. Sometimes toddlers need to be put to bed for a nap and our dogs are forever toddlers! The older ones figure it out quickly enough but every now and then need a reminder.

mostly for being confined, whether the crate, x-pen, even the fenced yard if I went outside the yard to the big acres to do chores without her she'd whine big time.
Is Asha ever crated at home? See, Ripley was crate trained as a puppy at home but never got to experience crating at show environments for like the first two years of her life. For a while when things opened back up, she was awful for crating indoors at class or trials because she was so used to the show and go style, crating out of the car (which she was perfect for and quiet!) She is much better now that she has more experience but always vocal the first 10 minutes or so. You could nail her with the ecollar, wouldn't matter, she'd whine even louder! Can't have ecollars at events anyways so that wasn't going to work as a solution for us. Walking away and leaving her alone with strangers fixes it for her. She whines because she knows it gets on MY nerves. She settles in and is fine the rest of the day and the more trials she does, the less time it takes for her to settle. But its just interesting to me. All of my other dogs? Perfect. Not a peep. They've been crated at shows since they were itty bitty. At home, they are crated randomly throughout the day now with 4 dogs in the house as we rotate them to keep things fair and sane. Ripley even gets crated now from time to time as she got a little too used to all of her freedom in the house :D She's been crate free in the house for about 2 years now so she was pretty vocal the first couple of times she was put back in one! :woot2: I swear though, they almost breathe a sigh of relief when they go in. Like they have permission to take a nap. :D
 
Probably an unpopular opinion, but whining/being vocal doesn’t bother me much. If it’s excessive and for no apparent reason, I’ll stop it, but otherwise I don’t mind. My last dog got “doggy dementia” towards the end and would literally bark most of the time he was awake, so that’s probably why I don’t care lol.
more mental stimulation
9/10 if Remy is whining that’s the reason. On days that we do a lot I don’t hear a peep from him. Occasionally he’ll “nuisance” whine then eventually gives up with a huff and plops down lol. If he doesn’t do that and I know he’s been out to potty, he goes in the crate and quiets immediately.
Is Asha ever crated at home? See, Ripley was crate trained as a puppy at home but never got to experience crating at show environments for like the first two years of her life. For a while when things opened back up, she was awful for crating indoors at class or trials because she was so used to the show and go style, crating out of the car (which she was perfect for and quiet!)
I had this problem with Remy and didn’t expect to, although I guess it’s my fault for not crating him in different environments. He loves his crate at home and I often find he puts himself in there for a nap. He’s also done great in the new car crate.

He was crated at class a few times. The first time or two he was fine. The last time I tried he was barking a lot and I eventually took him out, but only because people were filming for virtual rally and I didn’t want him being a nuisance… I tried once at a show because we had hours between ring times. He was awful, non-stop barking so he was eventually let out too. Whenever he was silent for awhile I would give a treat, but he didn’t really care about that. 😵‍💫 I’m not really sure how to train for that at a show without being a major annoyance to everyone. I think the training place by me is doing “rent a ring” now, so maybe I can do that and just use some of the time crating him. Luckily he does very well ringside and we’ve only been doing one show a day, so the crate isn’t a necessity.
 
Idk @Ravenbird…if you were able to use “quiet” to stop barking and she understands this, then I think you have a good shot at using “quiet” for whining. Especially since you are so diligent with your training. Then if she stops whining after the command quiet, then reward the non whining. That’s a pretty good win-win right there.
Truthfully, I've let it go for so long now, I rarely even scold her for it anymore. I really wanted to fix the long down whining in IGP, because even tho we passed our BH, all the other levels had the long down also, so I was thinking of our future trials. Now that I'm not doing IGP, there is nothing comparable for trial reasons. It's one of those things I pretty much gave up on... :(

Its inherent. I've found the whining is USUALLY for a good reason; out of water, potty, pain, need more mental stimulation, blanket pulled over them..
Asha whines because it's close to feeding time or she has been left alone, or as you mentioned crating at shows. Like yesterday (TMI maybe) we got a rat in a live trap, then I dispatch it by putting the cage under water. Gross, I know, but poison is not an option. Asha gets totally wild when she realizes one is in the trap and alerts me to it by barking and carrying on. To make things easier, I took her inside and closed her in my bedroom, then went outside to take care of the rat. LOL you could hear her 100 yards away and all the windows were closed. FOMO (fear of missing out) rears its ugly head. It starts as whining then escalates to high pitch yipping and protest barking. Stopped when I got back to the house. She only did this because she knew I was dealing with the rat without her. If I go to work at my neighbors she doesn't do this, but after an hour or two will start a moanful howling. With the long down whine it was a pity party whine, loud enough for everyone to hear, but not howling. So yeah, with her it's simply a protest thing. I don't mind the vocal stuff for the list above at all.

At the last trial I did try a new thing: Crating with the door open while I sat in front of it. She wasn't allowed out, but it made her happier and quiet.
No, I haven't used a crate in the house for years. If I need to lock her away I just put her in my bedroom. (She vocalizes but never touches or destroys anything, so leaving her in the house or my room is safe.)

All of my other dogs? Perfect. Not a peep. They've been crated at shows since they were itty bitty. At home, they are crated randomly throughout the day now with 4 dogs in the house as we rotate them to keep things fair and sane
I think this is key: Anything they learn as a puppy sticks better than what you start teaching at a year plus!
I’m not really sure how to train for that at a show without being a major annoyance to everyone. I think the training place by me is doing “rent a ring” now, so maybe I can do that and just use some of the time crating him
Yeah, it can be a problem, especially when, as I just said, they don't grow up doing it. Here we are at the last trial, over 100 dogs in a small room. Asha was not a happy camper. Again, I'm blessed that she just vocalizes and doesn't tear anything up. I can zip her up in the soft side crate and leave to go watch a run, she may whine but so far no barking or howling at a show.

@MichiH sorry taking your thread so far off topic! :anonymous :
 

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The older ones figure it out quickly enough but every now and then need a reminder.
That’s what I think happened with Kaiser. He eventually clued in that the whine wasn’t getting him the results he wanted.
She whines because she knows it gets on MY nerves.
😆 Reading our minds for better or for worse! If Rip is the only one who does it from your pack, and Ragnar was a lone dog initially too, do you think it’s a first dog/lone dog developmental behaviour to whine? She was a lone dog before the others came along. I agree the breed is vocal anyway but it seems like everyone with a whiner has just one dog…
Like they have permission to take a nap. :D
I agree the crate is a life saver in that regard. If they want to go go go all day, they need a physical barrier to force them to rest. Thank god we are not in that phase anymore LOL.
 
No hers was the COVID thing. She never got to practice kenneling indoors at events and classes with other things going on.
To this day I feel like Phoebe was cheated in her puppyhood since this whole state was closed, including dog shows and training. I couldn't even bring her into the vets office since it was a state law that clients couldn't be in any animal hospital.

But back to the whining, neither of these two are whiners, EXCEPT when Olive is in heat, then all bets are off with Elroy and it drives me nuts :pullhair:. I'm not sure I've ever heard Olive whine, but she will bark if something alarms her.
 
I noticed yesterday around one of Peppers nipples the area is swollen and firm. It poofs out as if milk were in there? Today when she woke up it is visibly noticeable as if she has breasts in two areas. Assuming mammary glands are swollen, but no milk and I’m not messing with them as I read you should not do that.

Definitely a flash pregnancy, what do you all think?

She is no longer carrying her ball around and doesn’t seem in pain when I touch the area around her nipple.


I do have a picture too, just in case you guys want to see and confirm.

Thank you!
 
Try red raspberry leaf extract next time she starts her heat cycle. It should help lessen false pregnancy symptoms since you know she's prone to them now.



How long does this typically last for?
Gestation for a dog from time of ovulation is 63 days average. They then start developing milk a few days before whelp and don't wean until 3-4 weeks. Don't touch her nipples and cut back on her food to lessen milk production. You could even fast her for a day to help as this is how I start the weaning process to tell her body to stop producing milk. But food and stimulation (+hormones) = milk
 
Try red raspberry leaf extract next time she starts her heat cycle. It should help lessen false pregnancy symptoms since you know she's prone to them now.




Gestation for a dog from time of ovulation is 63 days average. They then start developing milk a few days before whelp and don't wean until 3-4 weeks. Don't touch her nipples and cut back on her food to lessen milk production. You could even fast her for a day to help as this is how I start the weaning process to tell her body to stop producing milk. But food and stimulation (+hormones) = milk
Thank you @Rits and @Ravenbird. I’ll purchase the raspberry leaf extract as well, appreciate the link too!

Makes sense just like humans and something I had not thought about. Appreciate all the information you share, very helpful!
 
Just going through this thread again since Annie has gone into heat. I have to say the whining did increase a little since then. She hardly whined at all before that. But I noticed it's a little bit more since she's been in heat. Probably understandable since she doesn't know what the hell is going on with her body! :nurse: And it's not excessive. Thank God. But it's noticeable since she hardly did it before. A simple, 'quiet' will usually suffice. I always make sure that it's not for a good reason. Because a lot of times it is.

And with the Colder Weather came shorter walks or no walks at all. This dog needs to run! I'm sure without that release she's got some energy to burn. Boredom will cause whining too. I'm so glad she was a summer puppy! :thumbsup: If she was available in the throes of our winter, I may have thought more than twice! 😆 It was great having nice weather with a small puppy. :thumbsup2:

So I try and keep up with everything else. A little obedience, a little ball playing. Any kind of interaction to keep her active. She's still plays with a lot of toys by herself which is really nice. And sometimes adorable. 🥰

But reading about the false pregnancies, Etc made me wonder.... why? When they go through a normal heat why does it throw them into a false pregnancy?

How is Pepper doing @MichiH ? I know you're probably long past that now, but how did she do past the date of this thread?
 
. Ripley gets VERY whiny the months following her heat cycle.
Months?? Geez, these girls! ☺️ it's bad enough it's almost a month they're in heat and probably whiny. But then it's months afterwards too? That'll take it right into the next Heat! 🤦‍♀️LOL
 
Aww I’m sure a lot going on for her the hormones, heat happening, and the cold weather.

Yes, I have a winter puppy and man it was intense lol.
Spring was welcomed!

As for heat symptoms and whining I am not sure, many more experienced with it than me.
She doesn’t whine while in heat, but we’ve been working on the excessive whining with her.

I will say her false pregnancy definitely increased her whining. It happened about the time she was to be “due”. She also had increased discharge and carried her ball around, which I had to put an end to. We stayed on her about the “no, quiet, and enough” it didn’t seem to help, she did get over it within a few weeks. Her false pregnancy lasted about 3 weeks or so and she seemed fine. We kept the usual routine of walks and play. Kept her busy as usual.
 
But then it's months afterwards too?
During a false pregnancy especially yes. Their hormones are still working and going through the motions of getting ready for a litter. Just like with women, we are hormonal with lots of "symptoms" depending on where we are in our cycle, so are they!
 
I would take whining any day over my dobie who loves to screech holy molly as i put her feed dish down... only issue with her... she is the sweetest dobie.. needy ..but when she sees her feed dish she opens up like a fog horn...... tried everything i can think of to stop this habit.. but i say live with it...because she is the best loving girl......and i cannot believe anything i do will stop her... she just loves food....
 
i wish i was dealing with whining and some howling.. no i don't but it does seem better then the few episodes i go through daily with Lucette.. AKA Lucy,, i wonder if it is multiple dog syndrome or if she would do this alone too.. if i go to take out a dog biscuit...she screams at the top of her lungs in excitement while the other two just sit and wait for it........ when i go to give her her food..same thing.. The excitement she feels and expels far exceeds anything i have dealt with... and wow does she hit those high notes.....so lucky for me it is just a daily routine as when food is involved.. yes she is non aggressive with her food.. you can take it away or one of the others will come over and she will back off and let them have it.. this does not happen often but when it did it was a relief to see how she responded......any help or suggestions would be much appreciated.. but i think i am in this for the long haul.......... she is the sweetest most loving so she is really worth some of the ear piercing nerve wracking moments when i rush the food..lol
 
i wonder if it is multiple dog syndrome or if she would do this alone too.. if i go to take out a dog biscuit...she screams at the top of her lungs in excitement while the other two just sit and wait for it........ when i go to give her her food..same thing.. The excitement she feels and expels far exceeds anything i have dealt with... and wow does she hit those high notes.....so lucky for me it is just a daily routine as when food is involved
Asha does this. She barks wildly sometimes if she's extra hungry. Morning she flys down the hall then to the kitchen spinning and bounding around almost always 3 or 4 barks. She gets a can of sardines once or twice a week and she's standing at my side while I'm fixing her bowl of food - when she hears the pop top of the sardine can she squeals/shrieks LOUDLY, that ears piercing sound ending with 3 or 4 extra loud barks. I tried to tamp it down when she was a puppy, but finally gave it up. I do "shush" at her and at the same time stand still when she's over the top sometimes and that helps. But in general I'm just glad she loves life and is a good eater. 🤣
 

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