How to correct a nippy bitey puppy and establish a pack heiarchy in your home.

[Drogon]

Thanks. That makes sense. Yes my dog is still a puppy at 5 months. For IPO I've only done private one on one training with Betty. She's started us off with tracking, which is why I went to Luis (at Tops Kennel) for obedience.
I was very frustrated with my puppy's behavior on a lead. When he would resist, luring him only worked sometimes and took a while. From my own training, my pup would sit 100x in a row, provided I had a treat and showed it to him. No treat no sit. Perhaps I was/am just being impatient. Return when called is developing well with treats. He'll return when he's 100 yds away at the dog park - about 75% of the time, which is just as good as most dogs at the dog park.
Also I didn't want to train him myself with the basics because I didn't want to train improperly for working sports. For example most people teach a sit followed by a down but in working sports the dog needs to down from a standing position. Since I haven't completely made up my mind to pursue IPO or Ring, Luis is also showing me that for Ring the dog should lower the front legs first followed by the back legs for a down command.

 

[Nuggets]

I answered a post on another forum that was from a guy with a doberman puppy that was exhibiting dominate bitey nipping behavior and I thought Id share it here as well as it might could help some out there with the same issues.
I hope this helps......

You have to start out understanding that dobermans are first and foremost a protection breed, and they wont be a soft mouthed dog like a lab is. Therefore their biting and nipping can really cause pain and damage. Redirecting is good to help to teach the dog self confidence and allow them to play and tug with you. But with a pup like this you have to teach it its place in the heiarchy, You see pups learn from their mom how to pick their place in the pack and to respect the mom as the pack leader, this is done with the mouth as this is pretty much all they have to work with, when pups are young the mom will begin to growl or warn the pups away when they come near her food, this is how an alpha presents itself to the pack as leader and how the mom tells the pups she is the leader, she even sometimes nips the pups to get her message across, this teaches them to respect her and again their place under her in the pack. now the pups will also do this to each other, nipping and biting during play, this establishes their rank in the pack as the stronger higher ranking members bite and fight harder than the lower ranking members.

Therefore you have to realize that when a pup comes into your home this is all it knows and it will apply this behavior to you and its new human family, and this is why they will bite and nip you, grab your pants legs and pull, etc. this is how they play and how they test their rank in the new pack. You will hear them bark and growl when they do this, just like they would with their littermates.

Now that being said, the pup will accept you as the pack leader once you correct this biting behavior. this puts you as the leader and then shows the pup where its place in the pack is.
Now you need to remember that as the pup grows he will continually test his place and when this is done you have to correct him and put him in his place, this can be easily done by, when he bites or nips, you quickly give a NO correction simply grab the pup by the scruff of the neck or sides of the cheeks and firmly say NO, do this everytime he tries this and he will learn you are the leader and what you say goes. Now dont shake the dog or slam it to the ground or alpha roll it or any of this silly stuff, that can hurt your pup physically and mentally, just firmly grasp the neck and cheek scruff and say NO, this is like the mom grabbing em by the neck and growling, and it will get your point across.

I will give a few examples of pack behavior for you to look for, this might help especially since you have another dog in the house.

1- When a dog jumps up and/or humps your leg, that’s a pack behavior.
2- When a dog charges past you to get out the door, that’s a pack behavior. Pack leader go through doors and gates first.
3- When a dog barks like crazy at another dog that’s a pack behavior.
4- When a dog drags his owner down the street on a walk, that’s pack behavior. Pack leaders always go first.
5- When a dog tries to fight with another dog, that’s a pack behavior. Pack leaders say when and who to fight.
6- When a dog growls for moving it aside when you get in your bed or on your furniture. That’s pack behavior and needs to be dealt with.
7- When a dog growls at you for disturbing it as you walk by as it sleeps that’s a problem with rank behavior in the pack.


Hope this helps.

Thanks very much for the info/advice I will certainly try this out.

 

[AMM in the Mitten]

I answered a post on another forum that was from a guy with a doberman puppy that was exhibiting dominate bitey nipping behavior and I thought Id share it here as well as it might could help some out there with the same issues.
I hope this helps......

You have to start out understanding that dobermans are first and foremost a protection breed, and they wont be a soft mouthed dog like a lab is. Therefore their biting and nipping can really cause pain and damage. Redirecting is good to help to teach the dog self confidence and allow them to play and tug with you. But with a pup like this you have to teach it its place in the heiarchy, You see pups learn from their mom how to pick their place in the pack and to respect the mom as the pack leader, this is done with the mouth as this is pretty much all they have to work with, when pups are young the mom will begin to growl or warn the pups away when they come near her food, this is how an alpha presents itself to the pack as leader and how the mom tells the pups she is the leader, she even sometimes nips the pups to get her message across, this teaches them to respect her and again their place under her in the pack. now the pups will also do this to each other, nipping and biting during play, this establishes their rank in the pack as the stronger higher ranking members bite and fight harder than the lower ranking members.

Therefore you have to realize that when a pup comes into your home this is all it knows and it will apply this behavior to you and its new human family, and this is why they will bite and nip you, grab your pants legs and pull, etc. this is how they play and how they test their rank in the new pack. You will hear them bark and growl when they do this, just like they would with their littermates.

Now that being said, the pup will accept you as the pack leader once you correct this biting behavior. this puts you as the leader and then shows the pup where its place in the pack is.
Now you need to remember that as the pup grows he will continually test his place and when this is done you have to correct him and put him in his place, this can be easily done by, when he bites or nips, you quickly give a NO correction simply grab the pup by the scruff of the neck or sides of the cheeks and firmly say NO, do this everytime he tries this and he will learn you are the leader and what you say goes. Now dont shake the dog or slam it to the ground or alpha roll it or any of this silly stuff, that can hurt your pup physically and mentally, just firmly grasp the neck and cheek scruff and say NO, this is like the mom grabbing em by the neck and growling, and it will get your point across.

I will give a few examples of pack behavior for you to look for, this might help especially since you have another dog in the house.

1- When a dog jumps up and/or humps your leg, that’s a pack behavior.
2- When a dog charges past you to get out the door, that’s a pack behavior. Pack leader go through doors and gates first.
3- When a dog barks like crazy at another dog that’s a pack behavior.
4- When a dog drags his owner down the street on a walk, that’s pack behavior. Pack leaders always go first.
5- When a dog tries to fight with another dog, that’s a pack behavior. Pack leaders say when and who to fight.
6- When a dog growls for moving it aside when you get in your bed or on your furniture. That’s pack behavior and needs to be dealt with.
7- When a dog growls at you for disturbing it as you walk by as it sleeps that’s a problem with rank behavior in the pack.


Hope this helps.

HI! I have read your information above a couple times and have done this with our almost 10 week old pup. The problem that I am seeing is that he is nippy/bitey/growling with our 9 year old the most. Im concerned that he is in the Alpha position with her. She has been taught how to correct him, however; it doesnt seem to change his actions. He displays the behavior anytime she interacts with him. Do you have any suggestions?

 

[Doberman Gang]

At 10 weeks old he is just a baby and is just trying to play with her. You as the alpha will need to step in to teach what you will allow with others in your pack. Your daughter can also learn by helping with training when you go to obedience class.

 

[Viemarangelrock]

Just like babies, puppies use their mouths to explore their world. Those little needle teeth can really hurt. I would suggest...when you reach out (teach your daughter too) to pet him or give him a scratch, have a toy (tug) in the other hand to offer him. This way, he will direct his chewing and biting onto the object rather than your hand. You also need to set limits. If your pup is getting too excited or nippy, stop the play and walk away from him.

It is imperative that you are consistent when training and redirecting him toward acceptable behaviours.

Ive seen this myself...when children push the pup or run away when they are nipped. The pup thinks this is just more play and will continue nipping. With young children, be sure they are under supervision when playing with the puppy.

 

[Doby700]

Informative post pitts, thanks for sharing

 

[newdobemom]

Very informative post! However, what if circumstances are a little more difficult? For instance, Mauser is now 4.5 months, he will be 5 months on April 17th. But he has a broken distal femur as well, which is healing great without the need for surgery, so he is mostly crated during the day to prevent excessive activity. It has only been two weeks since he broke it and I am hoping it heals quickly because its getting very difficult to control him around the house and to prevent him from jumping and running. I think he has some sort of trigger with my hands because when he starts biting I will tell him "NO" and "Off" but he doesn't listen so one of the posts that I had read said to hold his mouth shut and say "NO" or "No biting". But when I do that he gets even more riled up and starts showing his teeth and growling at me and tries to bite my hands hard or my legs if I hide my arms and hands. So my husband took him outside to distract him and play with his toys. I was lying in bed when they came back in and Mauser just jumps on the bed and comes and bites my arm, I was facing away from him too. A friend of mine suggested to start using the prong collar on him, but is he still to young? And I KNOW he needs obedience training but I have not got cleared from the Vet to do so because of his broken leg. I try to do some training at home with him, I taught him sit and lay and we are working on stay but the biting situation is worrying me and we have two young kids. We always supervise if he is around the kids though, strangely enough if he even shows signs of mouthing at them we say no and off and right away he knows not to mess with the kids. Please help me out with some advice or guidance as to how to correct this behavior before he cannot be controlled. We live in northern California, so if you know of someone with experience then please forward their info!
Sorry for the long post.

 

[Regalis]

Very informative post! However, what if circumstances are a little more difficult? For instance, Mauser is now 4.5 months, he will be 5 months on April 17th. But he has a broken distal femur as well, which is healing great without the need for surgery, so he is mostly crated during the day to prevent excessive activity. It has only been two weeks since he broke it and I am hoping it heals quickly because its getting very difficult to control him around the house and to prevent him from jumping and running. I think he has some sort of trigger with my hands because when he starts biting I will tell him "NO" and "Off" but he doesn't listen so one of the posts that I had read said to hold his mouth shut and say "NO" or "No biting". But when I do that he gets even more riled up and starts showing his teeth and growling at me and tries to bite my hands hard or my legs if I hide my arms and hands. So my husband took him outside to distract him and play with his toys. I was lying in bed when they came back in and Mauser just jumps on the bed and comes and bites my arm, I was facing away from him too. A friend of mine suggested to start using the prong collar on him, but is he still to young? And I KNOW he needs obedience training but I have not got cleared from the Vet to do so because of his broken leg. I try to do some training at home with him, I taught him sit and lay and we are working on stay but the biting situation is worrying me and we have two young kids. We always supervise if he is around the kids though, strangely enough if he even shows signs of mouthing at them we say no and off and right away he knows not to mess with the kids. Please help me out with some advice or guidance as to how to correct this behavior before he cannot be controlled. We live in northern California, so if you know of someone with experience then please forward their info!
Sorry for the long post.

Unfortunately for you and your pup, things are going to be a bit different due to his injury. He is likely frustrated with all the pent up energy from being on such a restrictive schedule.

I really don't have any super answer for how to deal with it at this current stage as he can't be exercised like would usually be recommended. It really sounds like he's just trying to play. Some pups respond to having their mouth held closed and told no, others just think it's a big game.

I'd say keep with what you are doing, tell him no and cease all interaction when he starts biting and/or redirect to a chew toy. Just understand that until he heals and can burn off some energy, life is going to be a bit more challenging, for both him and you.

I would not introduce a prong yet. He's too young.

 

[XerxesYoga]

Thank you very helpful however my dog was the smallest and rejected she fights even more I recognize when she is hungry she comes like a tiger.
If i am tired she try more. I love her. Thx for correction tips. So far I think most logical.
8.5 weeks old Doberman * Rottweiler

 

[Doberman Gang]

I would grab the scruff of the neck and give a shake whine saying no, then redirect to a toy or a tug. He is teething and will be determined to bite. You can also freeze toys or wet wash cloths to redirect to and help him sooth the teething process. He will grow out of it.

 

[XerxesYoga]

Works very well. Thx

 

[XerxesYoga]

I been told I can do a loud awwwww and most of the time works and then redirect her with toys. I use the scarf pick up and gentle shake sometimes also nip her cheek gentele as my mother uncle use to do it with his hunting dogs. Dose the awwwww OK or teaches her I have fear?
I personally felt the balance working but they OK for in long run? I like to teach her mouthing people is never OK actually as I am sure with a breed if I am in real danger she will protect me.
Didn't use news paper today at all.
Ps: she did bite the vet.she dose not love to handle like a toy dog for sure. Even she is super pretty but not impressed with too many pet her.

 

[XerxesYoga]

One more thing since she was the smallest in litter when she gets too hungry or tired she actually starts fighting and bitting hard our vet appointment took long even I carried her for 2 blocks on way back she grrrrrrssss and attacked me few times. When we came back she did eat like coming out of a war.

 

[Pudding]

...when he bites or nips, you quickly give a NO correction simply grab the pup by the scruff of the neck or sides of the cheeks and firmly say NO...

I grab my pup by wrapping one hand around his muzzle, closing his mouth as I do this, and firmly, authoritatively, and loudly say NO or NO BITE! He's quickly learning who the alpha is.

 

[Jendisilvestre]

Dale,

I had to giggle when I read this. For the most part this will work UNLESS you have the one that learns very quickly that if they do the nip you and then run like hell, they will not get corrected. We had one like this and it was a daily battle with her for 9 years.

She was extremely well behaved in 'close quarters' but when you got outside with her where she had room to run, you better be ever careful with her or she would get you. She was not mean, she just knew when she had the advantage and had fun with it. Fun to her usually meant nasty bruises for me. Capt. Max would have enjoyed her.

Nellie

My Brutis is exactly like this! He nips as play, but I look like a fool running around in the yard lunging for him and failing!!

 

[Kaiser2016]

My Brutis is exactly like this! He nips as play, but I look like a fool running around in the yard lunging for him and failing!!

It's so tempting to run after them but in their minds it becomes a game of chase.

 

[Rosa]

Pitts - thanks for sharing this info. I nearly fall out of my chair when I read those post that say "MY puppy is aggressive - I need help" People buy a dog that is a dominant breed and then expect it to behave like a lab. I call them labs in dobe suits. This is incorrect temperament. I try to explain that it is a BABY not a dangerous dog. A BABY that has to learn the rules and who is top dog. I hope all new puppy owners read your post 10 times. Gosh I would worry if my puppies did not growl and nip at this age.

So right. I have watched people who have almost no control over their dogs because they never taught them at a young age. Now, they expect the adult dog to understand what is needed. I always end up frustrated because I know how much potential that dog had, but now it is practically ruined.

 

[Rosa]

It's so tempting to run after them but in their minds it becomes a game of chase.

My Brutis is exactly like this! He nips as play, but I look like a fool running around in the yard lunging for him and failing!!

At such an age, it is very difficult bordering on impossible to correct such behavior. Here's an idea though. We had a German Shepherd female who loved to fight with our other dogs. We cut down on such behavior by putting a shock color on her. I don't know if there is a shock color that you can control via remote control, but that might help.

 

[cjpmpd]

Pitts - thanks for sharing this info. I nearly fall out of my chair when I read those post that say "MY puppy is aggressive - I need help" People buy a dog that is a dominant breed and then expect it to behave like a lab. I call them labs in dobe suits. This is incorrect temperament. I try to explain that it is a BABY not a dangerous dog. A BABY that has to learn the rules and who is top dog. I hope all new puppy owners read your post 10 times. Gosh I would worry if my puppies did not growl and nip at this age.

This is my first shelter rescue & were told he was "lab/retriever." DNA says 79% Doberman. Farthest thing from. At nearly 70 years old we weren't ready for this type of dog. He is now showing aggression of snarling, biting at ME only. Yet I'm the feeder, nurturer, player and main caregiver for this dog. My husband is 74 with back/hip problems and I'm not too well, myself. I WILL NOT give up on this dog, but this is not how I planned on living my retirement years and he is wearing me out. I wanted to enjoy and love this dog as I have all my other past dogs. I've had cocker spaniels, poodles, cockapoo's, Shiba Inu's, mutts and NEVER IN MY LIFE, had to train a dog. I've shed more tears over this dog than any I've had except when they died. Paid for personal in-home training to have the woman tell me "she was at a loss." NO HELP. Took to an Extreme K9 place to have them tell me, "it's all your fault - now pay us $90 per half hour but you'll have to do all the work at home & pay us to bring him here to let us watch you." NO HELP. Took to vet & paid over $550 to run labs & xrays. Dog is fine & started on zoloft. Cant tell it's doing anything. Make sure he doesn't get any food or treats without setting first, we go thru all doors first, he complies. Follows me EVERYWHERE. If he hated me, why would he set next to me, sleep with me, come to me? I don't understand. I'm getting nervous to be around him as getting bit on the hands (i have arthritis in both), REALLY hurts. Never brings blood. Sleeps with me, but my husband can pet him first thing in the morning, but he will bite me. Yet he wants me to take him out & PLAY BALL. At a loss.

 

[cjpmpd]

I am glad that you guys are finding this post helpful and especially thank you for all the compliments. I just like to help when I can, after all we were all noobies once and had no idea what we were doing. LOL

I am 3 yrs in and still a noobie! LOL