Bullmastiffs

[Rosa]

I haven't watched the video, wish there was a way to just show clips of the waggy tail & high pitched bark. Just wanted to say, generally speaking, a higher pitched bark is more prey drive and the deep confident bark is usually defense. If I tie my dog back on her harness and tease with the tug, she'll lunge and bark, but it's mostly a higher pitch demanding/excited bark. If someone drives up our driveway, it is full on big deep bark, no nonsense bark. Waggy tail/back end again is usually showing prey drive, but some dogs wag with drive.

Aha, this is interesting as I know that our dogs tend to get high-pitched out of frustration. It's the gimme bark. The deeper it gets, the more upset and aggressive the dog is. It is like Twilight who I tapped with a treat last night when she was furious because there was a strange dog here (called a pitbull, but I think it was a pitbull/bull terrier because its head was on the long side), and her head moved so fast so grab the treat because she considered it an "attacker." Then she was like: "oh yum, my favorite!" and walked off to eat it.

 

[Oh Little Oji]

I will be honest that from my observation of the Euro Doberman, you can find many show lines that train in protection work (if you actually get from Europe it would be required to some degree)...have you ever looked into Pride of Russia? Di Altobello? Infinity Amoris? Sant Kreal?...say, you could always go for importing and see what happens...https://www.nobilisdomum.com.br/caes/ Now, the owner of this kennel does not breed for size. His females range between 65 and 75 lbs. The male is almost 90 lbs. They are working lines but you will notice that all but the IGP3 female have conformation titles. Price: R$ 5000 He does not crop or dock due to current restrictions in Brazil. As it is his hobby (and he does full health testings and really doesn't make any money off them), it is not worth the risk of what the officials decide is "cruel/abuse treatments." KILLI OD DVOU LVŮ :: Omniarquia Kennel These Dobes seem a little heavier and also heavy working lines. They can go up to R$ 6000 for a puppy. The breeder will crop and dock under certain circumstances.

Nobilis Domum has the daughter of Zulu and Zara currently showing in conformation. I expect as one of her brothers is doing IGP that he will get at least a BH with her before he breeds her.

Thanks! I think I saw you mention that Nobilis Dom... breeder yesterday but all I could find was the person't Instagram account or something.

The Dobes from them look not overdone like some Euros. The rust markings on some of them are just fantastic!

The second breeder there, I see uncropped Dobes.

I'd need some assurance that my next Dobe would not be a whiner! That's the number one thing I am looking to get away from is whining!!

 

[Rosa]

Thanks! I think I saw you mention that Nobilis Dom... breeder yesterday but all I could find was the person't Instagram account or something.

The Dobes from them look not overdone like some Euros. The rust markings on some of them are just fantastic!

The second breeder there, I see uncropped Dobes.

I'd need some assurance that my next Dobe would not be a whiner! That's the number one thing I am looking to get away from is whining!!

Oh, I cannot help you with that, but I could try to figure out how to ask...The owner of Nobilis Domum is one of the best breeders I have ever talked to as far as communication goes. Talk about a long conversation but I came away as an approved potential buyer. He does not like size. He believes that dogs should be strong without having to be heavy. Therefore, all his dogs are very compact. Zulu is really beautiful.

 

[Rosa]

Nobilis Domum Kennel - criação selecionada da raça Dobermann em Brasília - DF

Nobilis Domum Kennel - apresentação do plantel e da raça dobermann. Criação selecionada. Exames de DNA disponíveis.

www.nobilisdomum.com.br

I did it...in case you couldn't get to the website. I follow him (as well as quite a few other Doberman breeders) on Instagram...in fact, I'm friends with JanS on FB...I wonder if she knew that

 

[Rosa]

Yes, Omniquirquia Kennel does not crop their own dogs ears, but when I asked the owner, he said they could crop in the right circumstances. I expect he would have no problem doing it for you if he knew the dog was going to be imported to the US where it is already legal. Otherwise, there are various kennels in Brazil (Cane Corso, Presa Canário); I think "third-world" countries tend to be a little more concerned with the guarding qualities of their dogs.

 

[Rosa]

For example of Cane Corso: Ninhada Atual - Canil Cave Cane

This is their current litter born on the 6th of Sept. They have one male and three females available out of 12 puppies (6 of each). They don't give a price, but they do say that the puppies go to their new homes at 11 weeks with uncropped ears and undocked tail. All I will say for that is this, this would allow you to crop and dock as you wished. They get picked out between 5 and 7 weeks of age. They have been tested for hip dysplasia.

 

[Ravenbird]

the puppies go to their new homes at 11 weeks with uncropped ears and undocked tail. All I will say for that is this, this would allow you to crop and dock as you wished. They get picked out between 5 and 7 weeks of age. They have been tested for hip dysplasia.

In case you aren't aware, tail docking needs to be done at about 3 days old, not older, weeks-old pups. There is as huge difference in development by 10 - 12 weeks and since the tail is part of the spine, it becomes a major surgery. I suppose it could be done when the ears are done, but it sure wouldn't be ideal. Also, at this age there is no test for hip dysplasia. Maybe you (or the breeders?) meant the parents? Youngest you can test puppies is 16 weeks with PennHip x-rays. OFA hips are not approved until 2 years. Only saying this so you learn - knowing these things help you to ask questions to the breeder & being able to figure out if they aren't being fully truthful. Zulu really is beautiful, but I noticed his pedigree has Pride of Russia Sidor, who died young and tends to have a lot of DCM in his family/offspring. Zulu's Embark test is clear on DCM1 & DCM2, same as my own Asha. Asha's sire (a Sant Kreal bred dog) died of sudden death at age 7, so clear doesn't mean much anymore... hope this helps you in your own eventual decision with breeders!

@Oh Little Oji - Not matter what breed you research, the more you know, the more you know. I thought I put a lot into it spending a year looking & researching, but I know so much more 2 years later. Trying to research several breeds has to be pretty tough, as they all have their own set of problems.

 

[Rosa]

In case you aren't aware, tail docking needs to be done at about 3 days old, not older, weeks-old pups. There is as huge difference in development by 10 - 12 weeks and since the tail is part of the spine, it becomes a major surgery. I suppose it could be done when the ears are done, but it sure wouldn't be ideal. Also, at this age there is no test for hip dysplasia. Maybe you (or the breeders?) meant the parents? Youngest you can test puppies is 16 weeks with PennHip x-rays. OFA hips are not approved until 2 years. Only saying this so you learn - knowing these things help you to ask questions to the breeder & being able to figure out if they aren't being fully truthful. Zulu really is beautiful, but I noticed his pedigree has Pride of Russia Sidor, who died young and tends to have a lot of DCM in his family/offspring. Zulu's Embark test is clear on DCM1 & DCM2, same as my own Asha. Asha's sire (a Sant Kreal bred dog) died of sudden death at age 7, so clear doesn't mean much anymore... hope this helps you in your own eventual decision with breeders!

@Oh Little Oji - Not matter what breed you research, the more you know, the more you know. I thought I put a lot into it spending a year looking & researching, but I know so much more 2 years later. Trying to research several breeds has to be pretty tough, as they all have their own set of problems.

I was talking about the breeders (about HD) and from my experience with Euro breeders, they do not dock the tails until the puppies are picked by the the buyer. At that point, I think they crop the ears and dock the tail at the same time.

I wasn't planning to get a dog from Nobilis Domum anyway as I want my Doberman cropped and docked (I would rather a Brazilian cross that line instead of foreigner playing an ify game with the law). However, that is nice to know. I have no idea how that has played out in Nobilis Domum offspring, but I don't think he has been breeding long enough to really know. I will keep that in mind though as I move forward.

 

[MyBuddy]

@Oh Little Oji I meant to save something for you. I saw a video of a burglar. One of the owners dogs came out, a medium-sized dog. He was barking and lunging at the guy and then suddenly another big dog came out and really attacked him. Turned out it was an African mastiff? I don't know anything about them but I thought you might be interested. I'll have to try and see if I can find it again. The dog never stopped ! Lunging at the guy continually. At one point the guy grabbed the dogs ears and managed to get him to stop for a moment but then he continued until the guy jumped on a table. The dog held him there till the owners came home. I don't know anything about African Mastiff but he was impressive.

 

[Rosa]

I was talking about the breeders (about HD)

I meant to say parents there...

 

[Oh Little Oji]

@Oh Little Oji I meant to save something for you. I saw a video of a burglar. One of the owners dogs came out, a medium-sized dog. He was barking and lunging at the guy and then suddenly another big dog came out and really attacked him. Turned out it was an African mastiff? I don't know anything about them but I thought you might be interested. I'll have to try and see if I can find it again. The dog never stopped ! Lunging at the guy continually. At one point the guy grabbed the dogs ears and managed to get him to stop for a moment but then he continued until the guy jumped on a table. The dog held him there till the owners came home. I don't know anything about African Mastiff but he was impressive.

Most likely a South African Boerboel. It's also sometimes called the African Mastiff. I wonder if I've seen that footage. Is it from a distance? The criminal was kind of a lanky guy?

Yeah, Boerboels, I would think especially in other countries not in North America can be a lot of dog, and all of them have the physical toolbox to take care of business bigly.

Interesting factoid: Borboels, at least modern day ones, have Bullmastiff blood in them.

A not to little by the way, by the way: I guess we have some proof positive then that cropped ears serve a real purpose in a guardian breed. You saw that the dog let go when the man grabbed its ears.

 

[Rosa]

Most likely a South African Boerboel. It's also sometimes called the African Mastiff. I wonder if I've seen that footage. Is it from a distance? The criminal was kind of a lanky guy?

Yeah, Boerboels, I would think especially in other countries not in North America can be a lot of dog, and all of them have the physical toolbox to take care of business bigly.

Interesting factoid: Borboels, at least modern day ones, have Bullmastiff blood in them.

A not to little by the way, by the way: I guess we have some proof positive then that cropped ears serve a real purpose in a guardian breed. You saw that the dog let go when the man grabbed its ears.

Yes, well ears are sensitive along with tails. Everyone is amazed that we can grab our dogs by ears or tail without being bitten. In fact, in Proverbs it says, "like a dog taken by the ears." So the ears do play a key role.

What did I say? I really think that third world (or seemingly third-world) countries tend to have more guard dogs that actually have those instincts. It is like our dogs. They come from a mixture of GSD lines that you have never seen, but we have had only two that lacked the protective spirit. We shall see about our new male Ranger. So far, he has a great bite, is very confident and active, but lacks any real prey drive.

 

[Oh Little Oji]

Yes, well ears are sensitive along with tails. Everyone is amazed that we can grab our dogs by ears or tail without being bitten. In fact, in Proverbs it says, "like a dog taken by the ears." So the ears do play a key role.

Oh wow. I will have to look up that verse. Very cool! There you have it!

 

[Rosa]

Full verse:

He that passeth by, and meddleth with strife belonging not to him, is like one that taketh a dog by the ears. (Prov. 26:17). The context seems to indicate that this is a cause for "strife" or anger in the dog. Perhaps taking an otherwise calm dog and incensing it (most likely due to pain and the sensitivity of the ears).

 

[MyBuddy]

I wonder if I've seen that footage. Is it from a distance? The criminal was kind of a lanky guy?

The camera shows the whole backyard but only a concrete patio area. I guess you can say he's lanky. He was thinner and black. When he went to open the back door a dog came out that was medium size. Probably as tall as Cocker Spaniel? The dog went after him but I don't think he was much match. When suddenly the Mastiff came out. It was a big dog. I think he was as tall as a regular Mastiff. Not a bullmastiff. There was even a tiny dog like a chihuahua or something that came out but of course he just stood there and watched LOL

 

[Rnrgyrl]

Let’s wait and see how Rocco turns out… Rotti+Cane Corso- all natural. Yes very wiggly

 

[Oh Little Oji]

Let’s wait and see how Rocco turns out… Rotti+Cane Corso- all natural. Yes very wiggly

Oh man, he should be awesome! I love the markings and how dark the snout is.

 

[Oh Little Oji]

I have revisited this Cane Corso breeder's website recently:

Rockhaven Cane Corso | Cane Corso Breeder | Indiana

I had passed them by because they state their prices as $2,800 to $4,000. One thing I noticed though is that she made that claim that people could feel free to ask breed questions even if they aren't intending to get a pup from her. Well, she lived up to it! She answered a couple breed questions and invited us to Indianapolis to meet her dogs. She wanted the pup app filled out first so she knows who's coming to visit, which is actually a very good idea.

 

[Lizbeli]

I have revisited this Cane Corso breeder's website recently:

Rockhaven Cane Corso | Cane Corso Breeder | Indiana

I had passed them by because they state their prices as $2,800 to $4,000. One thing I noticed though is that she made that claim that people could feel free to ask breed questions even if they aren't intending to get a pup from her. Well, she lived up to it! She answered a couple breed questions and invited us to Indianapolis to meet her dogs. She wanted the pup app filled out first so she knows who's coming to visit, which is actually a very good idea.

Thats a great sign. She has to be proud of her dogs to show them off to people who aren’t looking to buy just yet. She probably knows she can get you hooked with the breed

Ill have to look at this breeder at some point.

 

[Oh Little Oji]

I have revisited this Cane Corso breeder's website recently:

Rockhaven Cane Corso | Cane Corso Breeder | Indiana

I had passed them by because they state their prices as $2,800 to $4,000. One thing I noticed though is that she made that claim that people could feel free to ask breed questions even if they aren't intending to get a pup from her. Well, she lived up to it! She answered a couple breed questions and invited us to Indianapolis to meet her dogs. She wanted the pup app filled out first so she knows who's coming to visit, which is actually a very good idea.

I forgot to mention the $2800 - $4000 purchase price does not cover ear cropping. She does full health testing though as far as I can tell, by the way. She shows signs of having her dogs involved in some performance sports.

On the other hand, there is CastleGuard Cane Corso Italiano, breeder with puppies in CO, show, working, and companion dogs , who has a $2800 pup price for all "companion puppies." and the ear crop is included!! You may choose to crop or not to, but a crop does not cost you additional money. You are required to alter the dog though, and I can only hope she'd let me wait until at least two years. I had thought that, okay, I would just buy a "show prospect puppy," which costs $3500; but that difference of $700 might be what a neuter would cost ? and I'd get to keep my boy intact. But no, they only place show quality pups in serious show homes, and you are required to title and health test them.

I have yet to find out if that breeder in Indy requires altering (probably does).

So, we have a breeder about 2 hours away where I could get a pup for $3000 or maybe $2800 if I'm lucky; and I'd have to pay an additional ($500 if I'm lucky) for a crop. So, $3500 - $3700 and a 4 hour round trip.

or

We have a breeder about 22 hours away where I could get a pup for $2800 with cropped ears. So $2800 and a 44 hour round trip.

Both breeders do health testing. Both breeders are big into confo. showing and have had a dog in Westminster.

I wonder if I would be able to find, hopefully with the breeder's help, a ground shipping outfit that would be honest, reliable and safe.

@JanS you shared with us how much you paid for ground transport, didn't you? Approximately how many miles was it?