Bullmastiffs

An American Mastiff. This is one of my favorite pictures of one.
That's a beautiful dog! I remember riding my horse down one of the roads near us and someone had a Mastiff in the yard. Standing along with it was a tiny Chihuahua! LOL it was a sight to behold. But he was beautiful! That color always attracts me too. The fawn/tan color with the black points. Always reminds me of the Buckskin horse.:p
 
Drooling drives me crazy. The mess Jasper makes drinking water sometimes makes me pull my hair out. Its more trying to keep the floor as clean as possible.

Jasper is 26 1/2in at 1yr 4mths. I feel like the extra inch or two would make a nice difference. He is already has a nice deep chest, just needs a little more leg imo.

I considered a cropped great dane at one point. I like tall dogs. Obviously they are not as protective, and certainly not as active. But then sometimes I think it would be nice to have a more naturally laid back dog sometimes. But Jasper has been the most obedient dog I have ever had. So hard to choose!
 
Obviously I wasn't finished stacking him. He looks awful there.
I only hit agree because of the rest of what you said. I know you weren't done stacking him there but he's never looked awful. :love:
 
Then there's this.

I had stopped thinking about a Boerboel, having gotten no response from the well-known breeder that is located near my in-laws' place. I was also worried I could not trust a Boerboel's temperament to be stable and reliable around my children. This picture was posted in one of the many glowing testimonials online. :woot2: :woot2: :woot2:

BoerboelInCrateWithChild.webp
 
I love Boerboels but like you I was worried about temperament. I feel like they would be good with immediate family, but what if I wanted to take him to a family party? Cousins, neighbors, running loud kids. My previous dogs have been great. Even Jasper is fantastic in this environment.

But I am not sure they are as adaptable as other breeds. I feel like they are truly a home guardian meant to be on a large piece of property. Im wondering how they are on a normal walk in the park, or a trip to the vets. I understand socialization plays a good part, but the breed is unique imo. I feel like it wouldn’t be as reliable in its training and may go to its “roots” in terms of behavior. If you get what I mean. I could be way off here, and I hope I am.

But goodness, they are everything I envision when I think BIG dog. They don’t have that smushed muzzle like some other breeds. Love their giant heads.

I am guessing the breeder was Black Iron Boerboels. You don't have to confirm, but I wasn’t able to reach them either when I was searching for one.

Check out Elite Boerboels. I didn’t do too much research on them yet, but I think a couple of the males really caught my eye on their site. I also thought about importing, but I have never bought a dog over seas. Im worried ill lose all my money in fraud or something haha.
 
I love Boerboels but like you I was worried about temperament. I feel like they would be good with immediate family, but what if I wanted to take him to a family party? Cousins, neighbors, running loud kids. My previous dogs have been great. Even Jasper is fantastic in this environment.

But I am not sure they are as adaptable as other breeds. I feel like they are truly a home guardian meant to be on a large piece of property. Im wondering how they are on a normal walk in the park, or a trip to the vets. I understand socialization plays a good part, but the breed is unique imo. I feel like it wouldn’t be as reliable in its training and may go to its “roots” in terms of behavior. If you get what I mean. I could be way off here, and I hope I am.

But goodness, they are everything I envision when I think BIG dog. They don’t have that smushed muzzle like some other breeds. Love their giant heads.

I am guessing the breeder was Black Iron Boerboels. You don't have to confirm, but I wasn’t able to reach them either when I was searching for one.

Check out Elite Boerboels. I didn’t do too much research on them yet, but I think a couple of the males really caught my eye on their site. I also thought about importing, but I have never bought a dog over seas. Im worried ill lose all my money in fraud or something haha.
Boy, I so agree with pretty much everything you wrote here! The "agree" button wasn't enough.

I don't know if you've mentioned this before, but do you intend to add a dog while you still have Jasper or are you going to wait until he's passed on? If the former, I can live vicariously through you (or at least let you be guinea pig :spit:)

If a Boerboel would be safe around my immediate family, I would be pretty satisfied with that. Thus far, I have not really had a Dobe that has been good in a scenario like a family party. (1st one nipped kids, 2nd one unpredictably and predictably "attacked" people, current one jumps on people – at least scratching them).

Going to its "roots:" I think I have the same basic concern as you. Not to step on anyone's toes, but I have a basic concern/suspicion of a lot of bully-type breeds, and some Molosser types. I feel they have what I term "dangerous potential." It may be a different type of danger posed by a Boerboel than by those other breeds, or it may be the same. I'll put it this way: You never hear of a Doberman committing a mauling. On the other hand, what kicked my mind back into considering a Boerboel was a woman sharing on a Mastiff forum recently that she got a Boerboel puppy and she and it just seemed so harmless. I then looked up that breeder's f'bk page and the first thing that appeared was all the customer reviews. These all seemed to be written by normal folks – folks who, frankly, don't strike me as having such experience as I do, and my sort of hardness and determination around large dominant working dogs. It kind of seems like this breeder sells pups to non-dog-serious people. I don't hear reviews that tell of maulings :lolsign:

I agree on the everything I want in a BIG dog thing:

Yes, no pushed-in snout. Yes, giant heads. I'd add: thick ol' necks! Sheesh, the power! I love it when I see the thick necks that sort of arch upward toward the head. It's like a whole other area where muscle is packed in.

A few things I don't like are: Unlike Bullmastiffs, Boerboels seem to almost always be higher in the hips than the shoulders. That's unpleasing to me, and if it's accompanied by anything resembling a sway back it's just yuck. Bullmastiffs are a square, short-backed dog like a Dobe.

Boerboel's heads/faces are not always that good looking to me – sort of off, wonky. A good Bullmastiff head/face is awesome (but again, smushed-in muzzle along with the poorer breathing).

I would need the Boerboel tail to be on the shorter end. It tends to stick straight up on the top of the butt back there and just look unattractive. As I mentioned a few days ago, I think I may rather have an intact tail actually; but I know this goes against the standard and is me wanting to have things my way.

I don't get to have cropped ears on a Boerboel. I was looking forward to the gnarly-killer look of the nice short Battle Crop I would get on a Corso.
 
If a Boerboel would be safe around my immediate family, I would be pretty satisfied with that. Thus far, I have not really had a Dobe that has been good in a scenario like a family party. (1st one nipped kids, 2nd one unpredictably and predictably "attacked" people, current one jumps on people – at least scratching them).
What about when you travel and have to board? Would anyone take that "kind" of dog?
 
What about when you travel and have to board? Would anyone take that "kind" of dog?
Good question. I don't actually think it would be a problem finding a place to board a big serious dog that may be on some "dangerous" lists. The real big issue is finding a place to board a dog that is not spayed or neutered. There are still some, and they are places where your dog does not come into contact with other dogs – which is the way I want it anyway.

Again, good question though. Are you wondering if nobody would want to handle a dog that seems that large, powerful and so forth?
 
Interesting that seemingly normal people are owning this breed. I too feel that I have more experience and consider myself to be more serious in dog ownership than most families. I certainly wouldn’t be a push over. I don’t think this breed has been “watered down” yet to where they are the friendly Rottweiler, if you get what I mean. So would I be able to raise it and mold it into a well behaved dog? Probably. But the unexpected is what worries me.

Maybe I am underestimating their intelligence. If they are calm confident dogs like I have read there shouldn’t be a problem from a well bred specimen. It would only be a problem if they felt the need to protect, which you better hope he/she has good senses for. You don't want him thinking a friendly stranger approaching is a threat. Theres no stopping a dog this size imo. Thats what worries me.


I honestly don’t know when I would get another dog. My house and yard is too small for one of these. So it would have to wait until hubby is done with pharmacy school (2022). So probably too long for me to be the guinea pig! Lol!


I agree with the “topline” of boerboels. You really have to find a breeder with good conformation. High hips doesn’t look good to me. That “U” shape bend in the back really gets me cringing. I feel like I have only liked maybe half the dogs I have seen from each breeder. I would only agree to a specific breeding of two dogs I liked equally.

In some ways I am hoping that these dogs are more calm than anything. Calm, but alert and confident. Something that wouldn’t randomly lash out. If thats the case, I have a feeling I would raise one properly. A dog I can have a leisurely walk with without any crazy outbursts. I would definitely work hard on socialization. Would have to be daily, in many different environments. No slacking on training. Jasper was easily molded into a good boy. I think a boerboel would be more stubborn.
 
Again, good question though. Are you wondering if nobody would want to handle a dog that seems that large, powerful and so forth?

I guess I'm thinking of this:

If a Boerboel would be safe around my immediate family, I would be pretty satisfied with that. Thus far, I have not really had a Dobe that has been good in a scenario like a family party. (1st one nipped kids, 2nd one unpredictably and predictably "attacked" people, current one jumps on people – at least scratching them).

Just being safe around immediate family and no one else makes it hard to board or enlist a friend to care for it. So I'm not sure a boarding place would take it either. How would they handle it?? It's just something to think about.

This is one dog of a girlfriend that I talked about before. I forget what the mix is but I think it was something with a Neapolitan? Maybe mixed with Cane Corso? I have to ask her. But this dog was massive! He was fairly friendly but of course, strangers were afraid of him! lol He would jump into the UPS drivers door and the guy would jump out the other door! :pHe didn't live very long. I want to say 8 years? This is a picture of my computer so it's not great.

20200424_113538.webp

20200424_114245.webp

She has something very similar again now. And I don't know why but this one is not that friendly.
 
I guess I'm thinking of this:



Just being safe around immediate family and no one else makes it hard to board or enlist a friend to care for it. So I'm not sure a boarding place would take it either. How would they handle it?? It's just something to think about.

This is one dog of a girlfriend that I talked about before. I forget what the mix is but I think it was something with a Neapolitan? Maybe mixed with Cane Corso? I have to ask her. But this dog was massive! He was fairly friendly but of course, strangers were afraid of him! lol He would jump into the UPS drivers door and the guy would jump out the other door! :pHe didn't live very long. I want to say 8 years? This is a picture of my computer so it's not great.

View attachment 107526

View attachment 107529

She has something very similar again now. And I don't know why but this one is not that friendly.
Too funny about the UPS driver's truck!!

I'd say it's probably got Cane Corso in there – the grey coloration and the slight underbite that Corsos sometimes have. It's got a lot of leg under it, unlike most Corsos. Hmm.
 
Interesting that seemingly normal people are owning this breed. I too feel that I have more experience and consider myself to be more serious in dog ownership than most families. I certainly wouldn’t be a push over. I don’t think this breed has been “watered down” yet to where they are the friendly Rottweiler, if you get what I mean. So would I be able to raise it and mold it into a well behaved dog? Probably. But the unexpected is what worries me.

Maybe I am underestimating their intelligence. If they are calm confident dogs like I have read there shouldn’t be a problem from a well bred specimen. It would only be a problem if they felt the need to protect, which you better hope he/she has good senses for. You don't want him thinking a friendly stranger approaching is a threat. Theres no stopping a dog this size imo. Thats what worries me.


I honestly don’t know when I would get another dog. My house and yard is too small for one of these. So it would have to wait until hubby is done with pharmacy school (2022). So probably too long for me to be the guinea pig! Lol!


I agree with the “topline” of boerboels. You really have to find a breeder with good conformation. High hips doesn’t look good to me. That “U” shape bend in the back really gets me cringing. I feel like I have only liked maybe half the dogs I have seen from each breeder. I would only agree to a specific breeding of two dogs I liked equally.

In some ways I am hoping that these dogs are more calm than anything. Calm, but alert and confident. Something that wouldn’t randomly lash out. If thats the case, I have a feeling I would raise one properly. A dog I can have a leisurely walk with without any crazy outbursts. I would definitely work hard on socialization. Would have to be daily, in many different environments. No slacking on training. Jasper was easily molded into a good boy. I think a boerboel would be more stubborn.
Some more late night theorizing for y'all: :D

I do wonder about if the breed has been watered down. Unlike with breeds like the Bullmastiff and Cane Corso, I actually hope the Boerboel has been watered down. This may be coming from a place of lack of information and fear of the unknown on my part though. I have a healthy respect and leeriness for Pit Bulls. I consider the Boerboel to be just as game as some of those, and equipped with similar powerful tools, but it's twice the weight of a big Pit!

So, bottom line, I'd have to decide what I would do in the case of an emergency with a Boerboel. It saddens me some to think about it, but I had to physically take my previous Doberman down and pin him on a few occasions when he went after my wife. That was a 90 lb. working Doberman. But a 150 lb. Boerboel that has a slightly lower center of gravity than a Dobe, and is much much wider, and with a neck probably the size of my thigh? I don't think so.

These are questions I need to ask a breeder! But do you think a breeder would take kindly to such questions?? I'd hope so, but I suspect they'd just cross me off their list. At the same time, I think of the women (no offense!) who handle Boerboels. I see positive reviews online from women, and some talk about how good their Boerboel is with their small kids.

I guess all is great with any potentially dangerous dog. Until it isn't. Last night I went down the road of reading accounts of maulings and killings by Boerboels – one killing of the owner who was an elderly-ish woman.

Just like in the past, I have to ask if I'm a fool for even thinking of brining such a beast as this into my household with my small children.

With the Bullmastiff, however, and the Cane Corso, I am concerned that I'd wind up with a dog that wouldn't guard and would be too wimpy.

Then there's the American Mastiff which I'd also fear would be too wimpy and benign to foes, but I'd rely on its pony-like size for deterrence.

The wondering continues.
 
I guess I'm thinking of this:



Just being safe around immediate family and no one else makes it hard to board or enlist a friend to care for it. So I'm not sure a boarding place would take it either. How would they handle it?? It's just something to think about.

This is one dog of a girlfriend that I talked about before. I forget what the mix is but I think it was something with a Neapolitan? Maybe mixed with Cane Corso? I have to ask her. But this dog was massive! He was fairly friendly but of course, strangers were afraid of him! lol He would jump into the UPS drivers door and the guy would jump out the other door! :pHe didn't live very long. I want to say 8 years? This is a picture of my computer so it's not great.

View attachment 107526

View attachment 107529

She has something very similar again now. And I don't know why but this one is not that friendly.

Too funny about the UPS driver's truck!!

I'd say it's probably got Cane Corso in there – the grey coloration and the slight underbite that Corsos sometimes have. It's got a lot of leg under it, unlike most Corsos. Hmm.

Screams Boxer to me. The face and the legs. Heavier than a Boxer so a mix of some sort.
 
Sounds like maybe another doberman may be for you haha. I know you say Oji is smaller than you’d like. Maybe find a breeder with more consistent sizes. They really are a great deterrent!

We definitely have the same concerns with the Boerboel. It might just end up being a breed I admire. I like to take my dogs in public and I am not sure how trusting this breed is. Same as Presa Canario's. Which is a breed I am sure you saw in your research.

Bullmastiffs are great family dogs. Maybe you can find lines that older or have more guarding instinct? Is that possible, idk. I just know the ones I have met were super sweet.
 
Sounds like maybe another doberman may be for you haha. I know you say Oji is smaller than you’d like. Maybe find a breeder with more consistent sizes. They really are a great deterrent!

We definitely have the same concerns with the Boerboel. It might just end up being a breed I admire. I like to take my dogs in public and I am not sure how trusting this breed is. Same as Presa Canario's. Which is a breed I am sure you saw in your research.

Bullmastiffs are great family dogs. Maybe you can find lines that older or have more guarding instinct? Is that possible, idk. I just know the ones I have met were super sweet.
Well, I can tell you that in the past as I have been opening my mind to other breeds, I have always come back around to Dobermans. We shall see.

I probably wouldn't go working-line again, despite how much I value their capabilities. I would find a good source for a Euro that would hopefully be nice and masculine and impressive looking. I don't think this would be possible, but I'd want to get a crop on the shorter side. I don't want to be one of those poor souls that have to post for 9 months - 1 year+ due to thick ear leather or something.

Any hey, if I get a 90 - 95 lb. Dobermann, I will probably pay a lot less in medication costs (like heartworm prventative and such) compared to having a 150 - 170 lb. dog.
 
Oh yeah ear posting is another thing. Luckily I had an easy experience with my first. But it would have been nice if he was born that way lol.

But I guess a Cane Corso really fits too with what you might be looking for. You will definitely be getting a larger dog, still athletic for its size, trainable, deterrent for sure. Im curious how bonded they get with their owners. Dobermans can be described as velcro dogs, which I like. But I think corsos are a bit more independent.
 
I guess I'm thinking of this:
Just being safe around immediate family and no one else makes it hard to board or enlist a friend to care for it. So I'm not sure a boarding place would take it either. How would they handle it?? It's just something to think about.

This is one dog of a girlfriend that I talked about before. I forget what the mix is but I think it was something with a Neapolitan? Maybe mixed with Cane Corso? I have to ask her. But this dog was massive! He was fairly friendly but of course, strangers were afraid of him! lol He would jump into the UPS drivers door and the guy would jump out the other door! :pHe didn't live very long. I want to say 8 years? This is a picture of my computer so it's not great.

View attachment 107526

View attachment 107529

She has something very similar again now. And I don't know why but this one is not that friendly.
I talked to my friend and her last dog, pictured above and below:
20200425_182931.webp

was a Neapolitan Mastiff/ Cane Corsa mix. He weighed 175lbs and lived to 10 years old. I thought he died younger than that but I was wrong. He was pretty friendly.

Her current dog, also 175 lbs. is an American Mastiff. And not friendly to strangers. Her son has two American Mastiffs and one is friendly and one is not.
20200425_182918.webp
 
I talked to my friend and her last dog, pictured above and below:
View attachment 107581

was a Neapolitan Mastiff/ Cane Corsa mix. He weighed 175lbs and lived to 10 years old. I thought he died younger than that but I was wrong. He was pretty friendly.

Her current dog, also 175 lbs. is an American Mastiff. And not friendly to strangers. Her son has two American Mastiffs and one is friendly and one is not.
View attachment 107582
Thank you for asking your friend!

Wow, the 175 lb. CC/Neo lived to 10!

So interesting that your friend and her son have 3 AMs between them. I wonder where they got them. I know that the original source is just a couple hours drive from me.
 

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