Polluting the purity of the breed

[UnitySpirit64]

This is not a serious post (unless you want it to be! Meaningful discussion is fine too)

We all do a lot of different disciplines with our dobermans! And even folks on here who don't dk anything formal typically have active or interesting lifestyles. What would you cross your dobie with to make the perfect partner in your discipline/lifestyle?

I would cross a dobie with australian kelpie to make the perfect SAR buddy. The disadvantages with gilly in SAR are that he's actually a bit big. (He weighs 87 lbs and i worry about if he goes down when we are out in the deep woods somewhere. Extraction would be no fun). He could keep his dobie coloring. Kelpies are high energy with good sniffers and less cautious of strangers than a dobie. No DCM in the breed and a long lifespan (the idea that gilly will live to 10 if I am lucky kind of makes me sick). And hey, maybe I'd get the pointy ears naturally?

Dobermans were made from 10 different breeds in there past already have many in them

 

[Kaiser2016]

When her litter was advertised I was impressed by the owners care of the pups and the pictures and history of previous litters.

Just what I wanted to know next. Did the littermates look just like Jazz too? I’m wondering if there was consistency across the litter.

 

[jazzies mum]

Just what I wanted to know next. Did the littermates look just like Jazz too? I’m wondering if there was consistency across the litter.

Actually there was quite a difference in colouring through the whole litter of 15. From almost golden Ridgeback colouring to about 5 who were like Jazz. Between were a range of attractive looking pups with darker shadings on their gold. From what I can gather from some of the other pups more adult pics their body type differed a little, as did their head shape, but they were all attractive and athletic. Jazz hasn't got the classical square outline of a Doberman but her head shape is close. The Mastiff genes seem to show up as added size and I'm not sure how big the other pups grew.

 

[Ravenbird]

Actually there was quite a difference in colouring through the whole litter of 15.

That's the whole crapshoot about mixes! It's never 50/50! Everything inside (personality, temperament, genetic diseases etc.) are just as varied as the colors on the outside. And just because it got the color of the Doberman doesn't mean it will have the personality of one. One like Jazz, who seems to be way more Dobe than Ridgeback, might be the only one of 15 like that, or maybe there were 12 more like Dobes. It's like throwing a pair of dice - so many combinations are possible...

 

[Oh Little Oji]

I'm totally not trying to counter what was said above, but it is so weird with Zephy'rs litter. There were four and they all looked the same! The specifics of the markings varied slightly, and two of the four had some white on the chest and some of the paws. I chose, I admit, partly based on not wanting any white on the dog.

Of course a disturbing thought hit me: What if there wee more than for in the litter and he simply culled the ones that didn't look alike? Nah, he seems like too decent a guy to do that.

 

[Ravenbird]

There were four and they all looked the same!

If I remember correctly, those were not two different purebreds that were sire & dam? They already had influence of other breeds so now those puppies in Z's litter had a mix of 3 or 4 (or more?) different breeds, so no longer 50/50. And did each parent have influence of a particular breed in common? If so, that would bring that influence up in %. With the breeder going for a look/style/temperament, this litter was a result of mixing some of his previous work, so they should be showing up as more alike to his desired goal.

 

[jazzies mum]

If I remember correctly, those were not two different purebreds that were sire & dam? They already had influence of other breeds so now those puppies in Z's litter had a mix of 3 or 4 (or more?) different breeds, so no longer 50/50. And did each parent have influence of a particular breed in common? If so, that would bring that influence up in %. With the breeder going for a look/style/temperament, this litter was a result of mixing some of his previous work, so they should be showing up as more alike to his desired goal.

I find it all interesting! Jazz was basically a 1st cross Doberman, with her mother being 50% Ridgeback and 50% Mastiff. In type the mother was about what you would expect from that cross in looks. No Ridge, some white markings and a fairly square head, but not slobbery. Her father was a purebred Doberman with good temperament and correct Doberman appearance, (to my eye anyway). They only bred 3 litters of this cross over a period of 5 yrs and never tried to continue the process to consolidate appearance. They were good dogs in themselves and served the purpose they were bred for.

They retired the bitch after this but she is still with them and part of the family. After this they have found a female Doberman that they were happy with and are breeding a select few litters aiming for the same things they were aiming for with the outcross dogs. Healthy, stable, intelligent dogs genetically designed to guard.

In other words the best cross with a Doberman is another Doberman! Have we hijacked this thread!

Just to get back to the original idea, I saw a picture of a Doberdoodle and it was so wrong!

 

[Rits]

Whatever breed that doesn't whine.

Besides that nothing better than a doberman, imo. Mine can wear a coat if need be.

 

[Ravenbird]

Jazz was basically a 1st cross Doberman, with her mother being 50% Ridgeback and 50% Mastiff.

I'd forgotten about the mastiff part! I was thinking Jazz was 50/50.

Just to get back to the original idea, I saw a picture of a Doberdoodle and it was so wrong!

I can't imagine... oh wait, I can.

Whatever breed that doesn't whine.

I totally agree! My housemate showed Dobermans when she was a kid, grew up with 4 or 5 of them (1950's), then I had 2 in the '80's and '90's. and working at the vet in the Doberman hey-day of the 80's we saw dozens of them. Zero whiners back then. Z.e.r.o. It's crazy-making!

 

[Oh Little Oji]

My housemate showed Dobermans when she was a kid, grew up with 4 or 5 of them (1950's), then I had 2 in the '80's and '90's. and working at the vet in the Doberman hey-day of the 80's we saw dozens of them. Zero whiners back then. Z.e.r.o. It's crazy-making!

That is very significant information!

 

[Ravenbird]

That is very significant information!

yeah, I just don't know what to do with it. I think I just want the younger generations to know it was not always like this! Also the close bonds were there, but the velcro wasn't. They were, how should I say?, content just knowing you were around, no need to follow you to every room. Actually that's the word: they were not needy.

 

[Oh Little Oji]

yeah, I just don't know what to do with it. I think I just want the younger generations to know it was not always like this! Also the close bonds were there, but the velcro wasn't. They were, how should I say?, content just knowing you were around, no need to follow you to every room. Actually that's the word: they were not needy.

It's like the breed is now emotionally stunted – lacking a maturity of mind.

I know they say domestic dogs are less mature, or have a mentality of a younger being, than wild canines.

 

[Kaiser2016]

no need to follow you to every room. Actually that's the word: they were not needy.

I wonder if humans have become more needy and/or codependent and as a result the dogs have picked this up. I bet in the olden days that there was also no such thing as separation anxiety in domestic dogs.

 

[Oh Little Oji]

I wonder if humans have become more needy and/or codependent and as a result the dogs have picked this up. I bet in the olden days that there was also no such thing as separation anxiety in domestic dogs.

I don't dote over my dogs and they still are velcro. Well, maybe there's something to what you say. My girls pet him a lot more, and when they come in the room, he is all about them. Separation anxiety was part of Oji's genetic makeup.

 

[Ravenbird]

I wonder if humans have become more needy and/or codependent and as a result the dogs have picked this up. I bet in the olden days that there was also no such thing as separation anxiety in domestic dogs.

I don't know about your first sentence, but I totally agree with the second one. If it was due to humans becoming more needy, it would be across the board with all breeds. Other breeds (maybe I'm wrong here?) don't seem to have snowballed so much in 30 years as the Doberman. It's like every thing they did back in the early days was mildly noticeable or didn't exist, or existed in 1 in 10 or 20. Flank sucking was known in the breed, but I never knew of any personally. My friend that had them when she was growing up in the 1950's said one of their 5 or 6 dogs did it. Now I'd venture to say 90% have blanket fixations of one sort or another. It might just be the bottleneck that happened in the 70's/80's - they found the gene for Von Willibrands and thousands of dogs were spayed and neutered before they realized they could breed carriers to clears and be prefectly safe. Then also the popular sire syndrome was going on in the show world, the BYB's were having a good time with the popularity of the breed, then it suddenly dropped and nobody was breeding much anymore. Our breeds relatedness is one of the highest of all breeds, and it's just not a good thing for them. Dang, let's get back to the funny stories. I'm depressing myself!

 

[jazzies mum]

This is a Doberman/Kelpie. Would no doubt be super smart, but not for me.

 

[Ravenbird]

I think the Kelpie or in our fantasy land cross the K/Dobe cross, would only be for a working dog home. Working as in Job To Do all day every day! But quick research says they are much like the Aus.Cattle Dog we have here. They need a job, they're good with family but not with strangers and generally pretty healthy. But not laid back.

 

[Oh Little Oji]

Dobe / Standard Bully
Working line Dobe / a particularly game Bully (meaning American Bully?) The Am. Bully is supposed to be a Pit Bull with the dog/small animal aggression bred out. So anyway, I'm just trying to relate the info posted by the dog's owner. Their Instagram handle is Calicatchers.

Good looking dog with nice coloration and markings.

 

[Rits]

They were, how should I say?, content just knowing you were around, no need to follow you to every room. Actually that's the word: they were not needy.

It's nice that Ripley is like this. She can be in another room and be fine. She will occasionally come check on me, maybe lay in the room with me, then leave and lay in another room. If I sit on the couch or go to bed she's definitely there with me as she lets out a big sigh. But she doesn't feel clingy.

 

[Ravenbird]

It's nice that Ripley is like this. She can be in another room and be fine. She will occasionally come check on me, maybe lay in the room with me, then leave and lay in another room. If I sit on the couch or go to bed she's definitely there with me as she lets out a big sigh. But she doesn't feel clingy.

I know there are many that aren't this way, now I'm wondering if it's worse with "single" dogs vs. multiple dog households? I'm sure having another dog to hang out with would temper some of that. Asha and Reckless both act like single dogs. If the house is open and all of us are in the house Asha is close to me, Reckless is close to J. If I go to another room Asha follows. If I go to town alone, she sleeps in her living room bed and gets up several times to look out the window, goes bonkers when I come back. Same with Reckless if J goes to town and I'm here with the 2 dogs. If both humans leave the dogs alone one is in their bedroom with the door closed and the other is loose in the house. Neither is destructive, Reckless isn't stressed but Asha is. My other dobermans were totally cool with being left and they were only dogs for the most part.