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Kimbertal

S

SonofAnarchy

Novitiate
Hi all.

So, I'm new here and am looking to purchase my 1st dobie (not my first dog, I've owned Rotties, GSD, etc.) and was curious why all the fuss re Kimbertal Kennels. I'm not trying to stir the pot and it seems this is a very hot button topic but I genuinely want to know. I have personally spoken to several people who have purchased pups from them and were very happy with what they got...beautiful, great tempered, healthy dogs. I understand they breed a lot of litters but that doesn't constitute a puppy mill. And as far as health testing, they absolutely do test their dogs. Again, not trying to ruffle any feathers I'm just really wanting to know what the fuss is about.

Thank you all for reading.
 
Welcome - and yes it is a hard question to ask and harder to answer. So I will try to give my opinion -

First they BUY some nice pedigreed dogs from Europe so they do have a fairly good chance of producing some nice dogs but because they do not show train or do anything except breed they are not really there to help you because they don't really know what they are doing except breeding.

The do take dogs back but they will put them into the breeding program whether they are the best dog or not - They are not involved in any activites to promote or improve the breed because their primary purpose is to SELL puppies. They are often not well socialized because they are kennel raised and I have worked with and seen some of their dogs and there was a lot be be desried - Good pedigree but not good match because there interest is not improvement but money.

You can get better and pay less. JMHO
 
First of all your name is awesome. Huge SOA fan here.


Secondly just look at the quality of the dogs coming out of kimbertal. Not to mention just how much they breed.
 
While I don't oppose Kimbertal directly they do raise a few red flags for me personally... #1 they breed far to many dogs.. #2 they purposely breed larger out of standard Dobermans.. #3 I am sure the motivation to breed is $... I suppose if you can look past those things you could certainly do worse. (No doubt you could do better to and I'd bet you could do it for a fraction of the price Kimbertal dogs cost.
 
The one thing I don't like is that their name does show up in a lot of pedigrees and as stated they do have some good breeding stock, but if the pup is from a different breeder and brought up correctly and bred responsibly, I don't feel it should be a red flag on the pedigree.
 
Kimbertal is a large puppymill. I would highly recommend against purchasing a puppy from them. I know someone who recently spent well over $3000 for a puppy from them. For this price you could get a very well bred puppy from a reputable breeder.

What exactly are you looking for? As someone mentioned, the DPCA breeder referral list is a great place to start. You'll want to do some additional research as well however. Are you interested in Euro? Looking for a pet, show, etc.?
 
Kimbertal is a commercial kennel - not a puppy mill. There is a big difference in the two. Puppy mills are very poorly run and the dogs are for the most part small dogs that can be kept in cages and stacked on top of one another. The dogs get no socialization - no real care except food, water and bred every cycle

Kimbertal is commercial because of the scale of their operation - but they have help and from what I have heard their kennels are well maintained and cleaned. My biggest problems is they buy champions from Europe that have retired and they just breed them. They don't know the standard or if they do they don't have any concept on how to produce it. I have seen puppies they placed as Show puppies that would not win anywhere. They were so shy that they could not function let alone go into a ring and they conformation was just not there. So the place puppies at a very high rate of failure and they don't care.

They primarily buy stud dogs and breed back to their own bitches which may be correct or not and certainly NONE are temperament tested and I doubt they spend enough time with them to know the temperament since the ones I have seen had temperament issues.

If you want dogs bred to standard then you have to go to breeders who work, train and/or show. How else would they know what it takes for a dog to be correct?
 
One think I like to add is that good breeders will take their dogs back and re-home them for you. Kimbertal as far as I know will not do that. We had a puppy show up in rescue with in the last year that was a Kimbertal. From what I have read they use to do things right. Then after a few litters they just when down hill. I would rather go with a breeder that raise the puppies in their home. So much involved in doing it right and put you so much farther ahead when your bring them home.
 
If you want dogs bred to standard then you have to go to breeders who work, train and/or show. How else would they know what it takes for a dog to be correct?
Click to expand...

D4E explained it oh so well. Why support something like that? (not saying you are but this is an open question to anyone) With no care to the standard and only care on money, this is something I don't think anyone should support. Purchasing the retired studs just allows them to make their dogs look fancier than what they are... titles only on the sire with not a single effort on the dam. There are so many better options out there with breeders that truly care about what they produce.
 
Are you in Pa? My husband looked into numerous places before we found a reputable place in Pa. I'm not sure if the breeder is still open but I can look into if you would like. I am very pleased with my boy!!
 
To be fair a commercial breeder is considered a puppy mill by definition.

I think better wording would be one has better conditions and more dogs then the other.

In this case kimbertal is a puppy mill but is well maintained compared to the ones we are used to.

They are both evil in my opinion.
 
Well by that definition Family Dobes, Altobello, Betalges would also be considered Puppy Mills. Where in reality Kimbertals has an outside breeding program which no doubt helps in some ways regarding puppy socialization.

Not really disputing any claims however I fail to see Kimbertals as an evil puppy mill. Their facilities are top notch and should make any breeder envious in regards to their facility
 
I don't know anything about those kennels so I can't say much.

There is clearly a difference between a say Petland puppy mill and kimbertal, but in reality they are all making huge profits through the neglect of dogs.
 
FYI as I mentioned previously I do not oppose Kimbertals.. I personally have no use for them nor would I ever consider a dog produced by them however I do not fault anyone who does exercise their rights to choose such a breeder.
 
VonDoom said:
I can certainly agree with the profit statement. I'm not so sure about the neglect.
Click to expand...

That's where it's hazy.

Is lack of socialization that ends up harming the dog later in life, 100% kennel Time damaging to the dog, not breeding for good health?

Is overbreeding harmful to the bitch, I think so.

Those are the questions I ask myself in regards to kimbertal.

Again I really don't know to much on this other then what I have been told.
What I do know is that people have used kimbertal a lot in the past.
 
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