Shock collar? Need advice please.

[MikeP]

Ehhh…not too much far off as compared to setting up a long line with a bungy’ed prong used to negatively reinforce unacceptable behavior, especially if the Doberman is so hard, high strung with high prey drive that it chokes itself out or causes cervical vertebrae damage…at least with the ECollar, I am in control of the stim and not the frenzied Doberman- but I get and understand your mode of thinking here.

Appreciate the follow up and acknowledge your critique of my post. Hopefully my suggestion can be interpreted as not representative of choke in the literal sense of “ choking out” as I understand to mean — high level heavy hand correction causing loss of control of bladder and more …..and also occurrence of possible CV damage …..allow me to clarify intent.

I deliberately specified a bungee at the front end of the restraint. I liken that to the analogy of application of pumping the brakes to stop at high speed if not strapped in, then chances are nobody is going through the windshield — hence harmless. Compared to a hard stop such as a dog hitting the end of a restraint with no give. I don't see the critique presented as being related to resulting cervical damage and “choking-out” damage when contingent on the use of a bungee.
Furthermore the graduated escalating pinch sensation will occur in stages contingent on drive or lack-of and is self correcting when in high drive in messaging to the dog to back off before full-out choke occurs, akin to the analogy of hitting the windshield.

In that post you are responding to, I was more or less trying to paint a quick picture of its damn near impossible, extremely difficult, to break through the max’ed out prey drive and bring them down to real time- “even when hit with stim of 100”. Wasn’t bragging on that, I didn’t feel good doing it and the “many times” was prob 3x

Understood and furthermore admire your candid response and never interpreted as a brag.

I give you last word.

In the common bond of Dobermans ……Mikel

 

[Corky]

OMG the prey drive is there with Miss Charlie!
What we are doing….prong collar, on leash almost all the time.
We remove the prong and leash when Charlie settles in for naps and bedtime.
When I am in the room, the instant I see her stop and start “the look” (prey gaze) I immediately say “leave it” and either move her gaze away with my hands or the prong and leash, depends on proximity.
If she breaks gaze quickly she gets a silly voice good girl and a single treat.
These other little girl dogs have been with us for almost their entire lives. (Rescues)
Charlie’s the newcomer and I am very motivated to learn to do right by her.
Honestly, if it takes a shock to break gaze and prey mode, then it just does.
I guess my feeling is if a little shock (hopefully all it takes is a little) will snap her out faster than tugging the prong collar, then I’m willing to try it.
I so appreciate the candid non judgy question/answer we can have here!
I’m gonna keep reading and learning how to do right by Charlie!

 

[MikeP]

The second thing they learn is a recall to both command and whistle

That nugget of wisdom warrants . Hopefully others looking for off leash recall, or when in the vicinity of danger or attractive prey then an abrupt stop-in-your-tracks akin to PLATZ might benefit from employing gun dog training staple exercises in particular Lab and retriever training. For distance control then using a pea whistle penetrates the environment of highwinds, running water, crashing waves etc. etc. far more effective than voice over long distance of 200-300 yards is highly effective and easier on vocal cords lest gun dog trainers would put the idea to bed.

For anyone interested and not into French Ring or Mondio Ring where the judges whistle signals when to start and stop an exercise then an investigation into its gun dog use is worth a peek. Needless to write I do no Ring sport yet depend on a piercing pea whistle or mini-megaphone mega pea whistle for reasons outlined above. One sharp blast to stop/PLATZ ….two short staccato blasts for a HERE recall.

In the common bond of Dobermans ….Mikel

 

[Nordika]

Honestly, if it takes a shock to break gaze and prey mode, then it just does.

A dog often will associate the shock with what they are looking at, just fyi, it may have unintended consequences.