Is cropping purely cosmetic?

[Oh Little Oji]

As I now own an uncropped dog (non-Doberman), I can add another reason that cropping is not purely cosmetic.

Noise. Not the noise the dog can hear, but the noise the dog makes!

Do they make decibel meters for phones or something? I'd like to measure just how much noise Zephyr makes as he shakes his head. In the late evenings as he and I hang out in the living room as the rest of the house slumbers, he periodically will stand up, maybe stretch a bit then do a shake. FLAP WHAP FLAP WHAP WHAP WHAP! It really disturbs the peace.

So, if one of the ideas with having a guard dog is to be able to work in stealth, if your uncropped Doberman shakes its head like all dogs do, it just gave up your position, alerted the bad guys, etcetera.

Zeph, thankfully, does not have long ears (I've developed quite an aversion to the look of long ears) but they are thick. They're actually heavy, velvety and just gorgeous, actually. I"d like to have my bedding made out of that material. I wanted to get him cropped in LGD (Livestock Guardian Dog) style, or a "Shepherd's Crop", which is very very short, but it would have cost $1,100! That was a nope. Even though he only cost $1,000, so I could've argued that I would be justified in spending the 11 hundred since I didn't spend $3,500 or more on a pup, but decided against it. It almost would've been a shame to cut those beautiful things off though.

So, anyway, maybe the thickness adds to the noise, or maybe it just makes it deeper. But they're noisy!

 

[JanS]

Do they make decibel meters for phones or something? I'd like to measure just how much noise Zephyr makes as he shakes his head.

I would guess they do since my Merlin bird app shows a graph of how loud a birds noise is while you're recording. That one doesn't tell the decibels but I'm sure they make something that does. Our parrot has to be way up there too when he does one of his annoying noises.

 

[Oh Little Oji]

I'm happy to have tickled a couple funny bones with my previous post, but I hope we all understand I am serious about the benefit I talked about.

That said, I remember my good friend's big German Shepherd made quite a bit of noise when he shook his head, so it's not just floppy ears. This suggests to me that someone with a dog with cropped ears, preferably a short crop, is best equipped for stealthy guard dog related work.

Yes, of course, GSDs, and now Mals are used very extensively in law enforcement and military work and do a bang up job. I just know that the situations I have encountered are many and varied and I often want to be able to go as undetected as possible. One thing I can do if I do not want to go undetected is tell my dog to bark.

 

[LifeofRubie]

Listen...

Moose's crate situation in our bedroom had to be updated to basically an X-Pen with space to spare because his shaking in the middle of the night was waking dog dad up so NOW he has all this space, the crate itself isn't making noise, but his ears.... will 100% wake you up from a dead sleep.

Rubie taps. Moose THWAPS.

Also agree with your assessment that there is little more comforting than a thick, velvety, floppy ear (until the middle of the night)

 

[Aaron56]

I think people ask about cropping because it is a elective surgery and posting can be quite a long endeavor. I think all prospective and novice owners should be equipped with as much information on all aspects of doberman ownership including to crop or not to crop. I don't feel people are "bashing" when they ask... IMO I'm not sure WHO would be a better source for breed standard than the AKC. As far as the health benefits...let's agree to disagree

If you had ever had one with a military crop you would know that there is very little posting required.

And they are more healthy, stay cleaner, pretty much unpossible to ever get a hematoma on an ear from headshaking and the ear flapping around, easier for the dog to localize the direction a sound came from with nothing covering the ear canal, etc...

 

[Oh Little Oji]

If you had ever had one with a military crop you would know that there is very little posting required.

And they are more healthy, stay cleaner, pretty much unpossible to ever get a hematoma on an ear from headshaking and the ear flapping around, easier for the dog to localize the direction a sound came from with nothing covering the ear canal, etc...

Great points.

My first Doberman had essentially that length crop. Due to poor aftercare advice from the vet., and my waiting until later than ideal to get him cropped, his right ear was terribly hard to finally get to stand.

 

[Aaron56]

Great points.

My first Doberman had essentially that length crop. Due to poor aftercare advice from the vet., and my waiting until later than ideal to get him cropped, his right ear was terribly hard to finally get to stand.

Guessing you read the forums (cause I see a lot of your recent posts) and know this is a new dog for me here. (her ears were already done this way long ago)

These things are like half or less of what I am accustomed to so I can't imagine how it would be a great deal of work but...

Then again, One girl out of my last pair I swear used to intentionally flop one ear over just to piss me off until I gave up on it and then about a month later the darn girl stopped screwing with me and picked it up and it stayed up...

 

[Aaron56]

Then again, One girl out of my last pair I swear used to intentionally flop one ear over just to piss me off until I gave up on it and then about a month later the darn girl stopped screwing with me and picked it up and it stayed up...

Just because I have them handy -

Here is Dystopia at a little over 2 1/2 yrs old (after I had given up on her ears because of that one) giving me her middle ear finger -

(dog and ear on the far right)

And here she is around 6yrs -

And 7 1/2 -

That dog was messing with me long after her ears were 'done' for the extra attention.

 

[Oh Little Oji]

It's not often we get to see clear evidence of floppy ears being used against a dog. In this video, the dangerous Pit Bull is controlled by a man who grabs its ears.

The man also eventually picks the dog up and carries it to a pool and tosses it in, which bolsters the argument that size does matter.

 

[GennyB]

As I now own an uncropped dog (non-Doberman), I can add another reason that cropping is not purely cosmetic.

Noise. Not the noise the dog can hear, but the noise the dog makes!

Do they make decibel meters for phones or something? I'd like to measure just how much noise Zephyr makes as he shakes his head. In the late evenings as he and I hang out in the living room as the rest of the house slumbers, he periodically will stand up, maybe stretch a bit then do a shake. FLAP WHAP FLAP WHAP WHAP WHAP! It really disturbs the peace.

So, if one of the ideas with having a guard dog is to be able to work in stealth, if your uncropped Doberman shakes its head like all dogs do, it just gave up your position, alerted the bad guys, etcetera.

Zeph, thankfully, does not have long ears (I've developed quite an aversion to the look of long ears) but they are thick. They're actually heavy, velvety and just gorgeous, actually. I"d like to have my bedding made out of that material. I wanted to get him cropped in LGD (Livestock Guardian Dog) style, or a "Shepherd's Crop", which is very very short, but it would have cost $1,100! That was a nope. Even though he only cost $1,000, so I could've argued that I would be justified in spending the 11 hundred since I didn't spend $3,500 or more on a pup, but decided against it. It almost would've been a shame to cut those beautiful things off though.

So, anyway, maybe the thickness adds to the noise, or maybe it just makes it deeper. But they're noisy!

I have to woder if the shaking of the head is breed specific. Riley has uncropped ears, not so long any more but he rarely shakes head. The only time is when he comes in from the rain. He does a weird dry off shake. He sort of starts at the head and slowly moves down is body until who ever is close is the wet one.
Maybe it has to do with rhodies don't leave their ears flat against the head? There are sort of perked so maybe they get air flow? Don't know, I just know he is one of the quietest dogs I have ever lived with. Rarely barks in the house and never whines. I think it says on the breed website that if they bark in the house check it out cause something is wrong.

You can see the "perk" of the ears really well in this pic.

 

[Aaron56]

but he rarely shakes head. The only time is when he comes in from the rain. He does a weird dry off shake. He sort of starts at the head and slowly moves down is body until who ever is close is the wet one.

Associating words with stuff you know your dog is about to do anyway -

I fell into the habit of saying 'shake' or 'shake it off' whenever one does it and then praising them after they get done.


If I just took them on a potty break in the rain and they are both wet they are going to want to shake that stuff off as soon as they can.

Outside is where that is supposed to happen...

Same thing with respect to getting in a vehicle.

You really want them to shake it off 'before' they load up / get inside if you can help it...

 

[MyBuddy]

have to woder if the shaking of the head is breed specific. Riley has uncropped ears, not so long any more but he rarely shakes head

Maybe cuz they don't want to get whipped with those long ears!

 

[GennyB]

Maybe cuz they don't want to get whipped with those long ears!

They're not so long anymore. Took a LOOOOOOONG time but he did grow into them. Thank goodness cause he was looking like a basset hound.