E-collar savoy.
- Thread starter GOD'S GRACE
- Start date
Kaiser2016
Well-Known Member
I'm scared of hurting him. Ugh. There was a thread showing the contact points for delivering a shock. And someone said their dog lost the fur in that spot.
Rits
Hot Topics Subscriber
Usually fur loss is from wearing the collar too long without moving the location of the receiver. If you study body language you won't hurt him. It may be a good idea to have someone that is familiar with ecollar use show you how to find his working level for the collar. Start low and work your way up while looking for any signs like eye blinks, an ear twitch, or reaching back to get an itch movement. That lets you know he feels it. Use as low as you need and only use higher for higher level of distractions.
A good ecollar can go lower than most of us can feel. Its more of a nag/tap than a "shock" like the animal rights people like to say. Try it on yourself...even if you don't like the idea of shocking yourself (this is me) it really isn't that bad. I could not feel it until 10 out of 125 levels and even then it felt like static electricity.
Exactly! I said earlier in this thread that Kali lost fur too. That's mainly because with her tiny neck I do not have it on tight. (In fact, so loose that she cannot even feel the shock because it's not up against her skin, but she can feel the vibe) So as she moves, it moves up and down. Wearing the fur. And that was when I had it on her a lot or for a length of time.
You are correct. There is a learning curve to anything and this should be looked into, read about and learned before ever attempting it. Even getting used to that it is in your hand! There was one time that I squeezed my hand, forgetting that I was holding it, and set it off! Thankfully, it was 'just' the vibe, but still, a wrong 'hit' will confuse them! You do need to be aware. Timing is everything!
I hate static electricity! lol I just cannot make myself hold this and zap! But then I can't tell you the last time I zapped either dog. Buddy seldom wears his and when he does its usually not on. And Kali is (for the most part!) an angel with it on.
So zapping doesn't happen. The vibe works great!
My2Girls
Notable member
Nothing to be afraid of. I’ve tried it on myself at a low setting.
I purchased a beginner’s/how to video from Leerburg.com.
Personally I like the simplicity of the Educator/Einstein brand. And they offer hypoallergenic contact points as well as different lengths of contact points. I have the short ones which are great for the dobie coat.
Yeah, I’ve gotten the collars and receivers switched around and zapped the wrong dog - oops- I felt really bad but they survived. My first level is at the lowest that gets their attention (just above the tone - it wasn’t the boost)
I purchased a beginner’s/how to video from Leerburg.com.
Personally I like the simplicity of the Educator/Einstein brand. And they offer hypoallergenic contact points as well as different lengths of contact points. I have the short ones which are great for the dobie coat.
Yeah, I’ve gotten the collars and receivers switched around and zapped the wrong dog - oops- I felt really bad but they survived. My first level is at the lowest that gets their attention (just above the tone - it wasn’t the boost)
OMG, I did the same thing once when I first got it!
I made sure to clearly label them and always keep each dog in the same hand. Buddy was always in my right. 
DN2017
Member
When do you decide to start using this? I'm curious but also hesitant. Feel like "if I cant train him properly without, I shouldnt try with". What are your thoughts on this?
We're at a stage where he knows all commands but often only does them when we are training with snacks. For example, we're practicing "place" with food and it goes well. Half an hour later we're sitting on the couch and he walks around and doesnt go to his place when i tell him to.
The same with recall outside. Recall around the house is mostly fine, unless he has something in his mouth he doesnt want to share, but outside he only comes when he feels like it.
Just teenage behaviour and ready to start e collar training? Or regular training is not sufficient enough and I should continue what I'm doing now?
Ofcourse only ecollar training under guidance of a good teacher.
We're at a stage where he knows all commands but often only does them when we are training with snacks. For example, we're practicing "place" with food and it goes well. Half an hour later we're sitting on the couch and he walks around and doesnt go to his place when i tell him to.
The same with recall outside. Recall around the house is mostly fine, unless he has something in his mouth he doesnt want to share, but outside he only comes when he feels like it.
Just teenage behaviour and ready to start e collar training? Or regular training is not sufficient enough and I should continue what I'm doing now?
Ofcourse only ecollar training under guidance of a good teacher.
Trigger LockedLoaded
New Member
I'm kinda surprised that alot you guys use e-collars. I always hear mixed stuff about them. People call them inhumane my vet was pretty much begging me not to train Trigger with a e-collar as well. I watch many many videos of trainers and owners and it seems like they have a ton of success. Anyone against using this method ? Just interested to hear other owners point of view. Thanks also I am not against E-collars just to clarify.
GOD'S GRACE
Notable member
I started training with a e-collar with my Doxies...stubborn is stubborn...enough said? No....will when your dog is on the other side of the field just looking at you, while you get all crazy calling for him, remember mine comes right back with a quick tone buzz..
>>>human 1...>>>dobe 0... .
>>>human 1...>>>dobe 0... .
Kaiser2016
Well-Known Member
I bet a lot of people consider a lot of what we do with Dobermans (and/or working dogs in general?) to be inhumane. Start with the ears, the tails, prong collars, e-collars, crates, not snipping them at 6 months (which isn't good for any dog!), I won't even get into some of the old school training techniques versus positive-only training. I was trying to avoid the prong for the longest time, but I can't get along without it. A positive-only trainer told me it's because I'm not willing to put in the work to get him to stop pulling while on a normal collar. I don't think she's right, because we worked on it a lot, but I also wish I didn't have to resort to so many of these devices which get stupid comments from people.
You know, I have read, researched, observed, you tubed, and tried the training my self. There is only so much I can be successful at, with Ragnar, before I feel like I am just doing it the wrong way. And I want it done the RIGHT way.
The videos I have seen of before/after ecollar training with an instructor look to be very promising. The before video, I watched, is exactly what Ragnar does- knows what’s right but distracted and does when he wants. The video after ecollar training is the direction I want to go with him. Attentive, consistent and listens to commands when instructed.
Jumping the gun and giving up on myself too soon?? Maybe so... but I really need some reassurance and progress because I feel I have plateaued.
Ragnar starts Ecollar Offleash Training this Saturday.
The videos I have seen of before/after ecollar training with an instructor look to be very promising. The before video, I watched, is exactly what Ragnar does- knows what’s right but distracted and does when he wants. The video after ecollar training is the direction I want to go with him. Attentive, consistent and listens to commands when instructed.
Jumping the gun and giving up on myself too soon?? Maybe so... but I really need some reassurance and progress because I feel I have plateaued.
Ragnar starts Ecollar Offleash Training this Saturday.
Kaiser2016
Well-Known Member
Agree with everything you wrote but this resonated with me. The other night Kaiser bolted from the garage and ran through the neighborhood like he was freed from prison. It was horrible. He could NOT be called back. It's not a busy neighborhood but all it takes is one person racing through. Good on you for tackling this so early on. We've got ourselves a 21 month old who FOR SURE knows better so it's more than time to get him sorted out.
Rits
Hot Topics Subscriber
I don't personally like using the ecollar for any basic obedience. I feel all of that can be reinforced and rewarded to be shaped without the use of an ecollar. Only once they KNOW the command and choose to blow it off...which usually most need help with the recall for this. Ecollar use here is 99% recall. So puppies? Definitely not. You need to get through the puppy phase first. Everything should be fun for a puppy.
Remember once you start using the ecollar for basic obedience you won't have fun asking them to behave when the collar isn't on. Do everything in your power to train without. If you ever decide to compete, even for fun, ecollars are definitely not allowed. Even prong collars are usually not. And Im one of those that's been trying to wean one of my dogs off the prong her whole life since we cannot use it when we go to trials. It's a battle.
Remember once you start using the ecollar for basic obedience you won't have fun asking them to behave when the collar isn't on. Do everything in your power to train without.
If you ever decide to compete, even for fun, ecollars are definitely not allowed. Even prong collars are usually not. And Im one of those that's been trying to wean one of my dogs off the prong her whole life since we cannot use it when we go to trials. It's a battle.
Kaiser2016
Well-Known Member
Trigger LockedLoaded
New Member
Trigger is a puppy only 5 months and I sware he is so damn stubborn i repeat myself a million times about shoes and a few other things. Bottom line when hes not in the mood hes not doing it until I get mad and yell then he jumps. What e-collar do you guys suggest ? Brand type etc. Thanks guys
I used to be totally against an e-collar. I thought it was totally cruel and felt that people must be using these as a weapon. I just didn't like the thought of zapping my dog.
Like anything, when you dig deeper, and learn about the tool, things become more clear. You find out the how, why, and where for. I'm certain there are a lot of people who use these collars incorrectly. But when I found out the correct way to use them, I found they can be quite useful. Like @Rits was saying, it's not something you start with. You start with basic obedience. Your dog should be well trained on all commands. In my opinion, and I believe the opinion of anyone who uses this collar, it is to teach a dog who already knows all commands that he cannot diss you. Or, and most importantly, it may save your dog's life in that one moment when they want to take chase across the street, or after a deer, etc.
I still remember my first Dobermans breeder putting an e-collar on one of her superbly trained Dobermans. I was shocked. Until she told me that she was going out to a open field for training and the e-collar was simply a backup for that one moment that could happen. A squirrel, or whatever else that would take the dogs attention away from her for a split second and possibly run into the road. I never forgot that. Because believe me, her dogs were so well trained that I was surprised she had to use them. But you see how it was used. It's on a well-trained dog and it's just used as a insurance policy for that one moment that could save the dog's life.
It's for that moment when your dog is off leash, well trained to commands, but suddenly decides to diss you. Then you can reach out and touch him. To his surprise!
Like anything, when you dig deeper, and learn about the tool, things become more clear. You find out the how, why, and where for. I'm certain there are a lot of people who use these collars incorrectly. But when I found out the correct way to use them, I found they can be quite useful. Like @Rits was saying, it's not something you start with. You start with basic obedience. Your dog should be well trained on all commands. In my opinion, and I believe the opinion of anyone who uses this collar, it is to teach a dog who already knows all commands that he cannot diss you. Or, and most importantly, it may save your dog's life in that one moment when they want to take chase across the street, or after a deer, etc.
I still remember my first Dobermans breeder putting an e-collar on one of her superbly trained Dobermans. I was shocked. Until she told me that she was going out to a open field for training and the e-collar was simply a backup for that one moment that could happen. A squirrel, or whatever else that would take the dogs attention away from her for a split second and possibly run into the road. I never forgot that. Because believe me, her dogs were so well trained that I was surprised she had to use them. But you see how it was used. It's on a well-trained dog and it's just used as a insurance policy for that one moment that could save the dog's life.
It's for that moment when your dog is off leash, well trained to commands, but suddenly decides to diss you. Then you can reach out and touch him. To his surprise!
blacknrust
Hot Topics Subscriber
I started e-collar training with Maeve at 9 months. She had good obedience with me but was challenging my teenagers. I took private lessons with my trainer for 5 weeks learning how to use for proper timing and settings. Looking for that little twitch that she felt it. Only I used it in the beginning, slowly teaching my kids the proper use. I think I went over a level 3 stim just once. She's pretty sensitive to it. At this point, she wears it daily and mostly it's just the vibrate setting for focus on me when off leash walks.
Kaiser2016
Well-Known Member
Great information! An insurance policy. Yes. This is a good way to think of it. His off leash obedience is the main worry. If he's not distracted his off leash recall is great. But a distraction...with the hormones all raging like they have been in the past month...well I wouldn't trust him.
Trigger LockedLoaded
New Member
Any brands you guys can suggest
Rits
Hot Topics Subscriber
I don't think anyone is going to directly suggest an ecollar brand for a 5 month old puppy. I would focus on finding other ways to reinforce his obedience and enroll in basic obedience classes. You've had him for 4 weeks, give it time and put in the work! He is after all, just a baby.
If you really desire to find recommended brands for when he gets older, there are threads out there by using the search feature.
