Nosework Training

[remy]

Second time doing exterior searches! We did 5 but I don’t have a video of the first. Like last time, I brought him inside between searches while I hid the next hide.

He was pretty quick today! I was surprised how fast he found the hide in the second clip, it was behind the blue pillow on the left. The longest search was the last clip (on the egg chair) which took about 25-30 seconds.

In the last two clips he knocked the tin down with his paw. How should I correct that while still marking/rewarding for finding the hide? The first time I was surprised and said “oh, no no no” without really thinking lol. The second time I said “leave it”, but I’m wondering if that is confusing to him? I will double check, but I don’t remember this being addressed in the class, only box smashing.

I have a few things for myself to work on too lol. I was slightly slow to mark for some of his finds. I also switched up what I said when releasing him to search, “find it”, “go find it” and “go find”… This is why I need to record these more often!

 

[Ravenbird]

In the last two clips he knocked the tin down with his paw. How should I correct that while still marking/rewarding for finding the hide? The first time I was surprised and said “oh, no no no” without really thinking lol. The second time I said “leave it”, but I’m wondering if that is confusing to him? I will double check, but I don’t remember this being addressed in the class, only box smashing.

Super job!!! I'd be especially proud of that egg chair search: he was trying really hard to find exactly where it was, from searching the cushions first, then moving around to try to source it from the back of the chair. The odor was moving through all the holes and he worked beautifully to pinpoint it! I saw a couple of times where he hit the end of the leash which equals being held back for a split second/a slight distraction for him, but he's drivey enough he doesn't care, so no harm done. BUT If you have a longer leash start using it for practice, and if you don't please get one. Yes, you will get tangled up when he moves fast in tight spaces, but that's why you want to practice with it before trial. I use a skinny biothane 10' leash, many people use 15 - 20'. The biothane is outdoor friendly, doesn't tangle easily & weeds don't stick to it. In trial, any time they allow off leash in interior or exterior I do that, but you have to know your dog will stay to task.

Totally ignore the issue of knocking a tin down with his paw, never correct with a no-no or leave it - you don't want him to hear that when he found the hide! In trial there will never be a visible tin or anything he can paw except boxes/containers (or buried containers) so it won't be an issue in trial. On your part you can try securing them better, but if you put those magnet tins on anything they will come off pretty easily with an enthusiastic dog. If that metal of the leg extends to the underside of the table/chair/whatever, you can put it just under the rim so he can't paw it. I actually think this is part of him learning what great fun it is to "show you" and he will get more business-like as he continues learning, but as everything else, better to prevent it with invisible hides so he can't practice pawing.

You're doing great, Novice will be a breeze for Team Remy!

 

[remy]

Super job!!! I'd be especially proud of that egg chair search: he was trying really hard to find exactly where it was, from searching the cushions first, then moving around to try to source it from the back of the chair. The odor was moving through all the holes and he worked beautifully to pinpoint it!

I didn’t even think about how the holes could effect the odor!

I saw a couple of times where he hit the end of the leash which equals being held back for a split second/a slight distraction for him, but he's drivey enough he doesn't care, so no harm done. BUT If you have a longer leash start using it for practice, and if you don't please get one.

I plan to get a 10-12ft leash soon! Besides for 6ft leashes, I only have a 30ft longline. Maybe for now I can practice with that and just let some of the leash out (keep the rest rolled up in my hand).

In trial, any time they allow off leash in interior or exterior I do that, but you have to know your dog will stay to task.

Usually indoors (at home) he works off leash, but I wouldn’t try that at a trial unless he had a lot of experience doing it in other environments first.

Totally ignore the issue of knocking a tin down with his paw, never correct with a no-no or leave it - you don't want him to hear that when he found the hide!

Thank you. That’s what I thought! I wasn’t sure what to do and after watching back the videos, I thought saying that could make him think he didn’t find the odor.

On your part you can try securing them better, but if you put those magnet tins on anything they will come off pretty easily with an enthusiastic dog. If that metal of the leg extends to the underside of the table/chair/whatever, you can put it just under the rim so he can't paw it. I actually think this is part of him learning what great fun it is to "show you" and he will get more business-like as he continues learning, but as everything else, better to prevent it with invisible hides so he can't practice pawing.

I’ll try moving them a little further under next time! I only have the magnetic tins and shrink wrap tubes that the kit came with, I really need to get some more hides lol.

You're doing great, Novice will be a breeze for Team Remy!

Thank you! I think we will trial in September and see how it goes. There are 2 different trials; one with interior, containers and buried, the other with interior, exterior and containers. I still have to introduce him to buried and work on containers again. So far he’s only done them once and box smashing was a big issue.

 

[Rits]

What a good boy!! He knows his job and gets right to work! Love his enthusiasm.

 

[remy]

Love his enthusiasm.

Me too! I think it’s become his favorite thing to train for.

 

[Ravenbird]

I think we will trial in September and see how it goes. There are 2 different trials; one with interior, containers and buried, the other with interior, exterior and containers. I still have to introduce him to buried and work on containers again. So far he’s only done them once and box smashing was a big issue.

He appears to know his odor well, just keep working with the boxes so you can see if the box smashing still needs a cure. He may or may not paw at the sand containers, but it would be good to start him on that too so you know if you're needing to work on the pawing along with the new element of sand. It takes so many trials to get the Whole Title of SWN (3 Qs in each of the 4 elements = 12 Q's!) so I always entered all the elements every time I went. Sometimes we did great, but when she didn't Q I learned a whole lot about what we needed to work on. It was always worth the experience.

 

[remy]

He appears to know his odor well, just keep working with the boxes so you can see if the box smashing still needs a cure. He may or may not paw at the sand containers, but it would be good to start him on that too so you know if you're needing to work on the pawing along with the new element of sand.

We’ll be gone Wednesday-Sunday for his shows, but after that I plan to start on buried (and restart containers)! I’m thinking of brining his stuff along to the Airbnb to work on interior & exterior searches in a new place.

It takes so many trials to get the Whole Title of SWN (3 Qs in each of the 4 elements = 12 Q's!) so I always entered all the elements every time I went. Sometimes we did great, but when she didn't Q I learned a whole lot about what we needed to work on. It was always worth the experience.

I’m going to do the same. All of the scent work trials are 3ish hours away, so I don’t see any point in just doing one or two elements when more are offered lol.

 

[Ravenbird]

I’m thinking of brining his stuff along to the Airbnb to work on interior & exterior searches in a new place.

Excellent idea. That video the other day of Asha, I wanted to hike, and thought ugh, I need to do some NW... then I just thought - take it with you! I didn't bother with harness and she had her hiking collar (ID tags) and e-collar on, but she is seasoned enough that she knows the "stance" and the "sook" word. With your new-at-this dog, I would try to stay with his "trial outfit" while training, it really does condition them to understand what game they are about to play. Also, I don't know if your online instruction talked about "start line", but I learned to hold my dog still for at least 5 seconds, facing the start line (two 8" orange cones or similar) and some gentle pulling back on the harness (pressure creates drive) and then letting go and saying "Sook" (or Find It) at the same time. In no time they start scanning the area for direction of odor while you hold them still. This becomes especially meaningful when you go other locations outside your home - the lightbulb goes on: OH, we're doing what we've been doing at the house!!! Then when you go to trial it's just "another place" where you play this game. Lots of dogs around, but hey, harness on, not show collar, they know instantly what they are there to do!

All of the scent work trials are 3ish hours away, so I don’t see any point in just doing one or two elements when more are offered lol.

Same. I have a 3 day trial in August, 4 hour drive away, so after gas & motel might as well get all the experiences we can!

 

[remy]

We just did 5 exterior searches. I had someone else hide them and play judge for us so I can gauge how well I read his alerts. I wasn’t able to get video since my phone was dying.

Remy did really well! He found all 5 hides and clearly alerted (nose hold) for all of them, which made me really happy! The quickest search was probably 10 seconds and the longest 1 minute or more, he got distracted for awhile by kids on electric bikes going by. That was also our last search. To be honest I probably should have stopped after 4 searches because it was still pretty hot out too.

I’ve been slacking and haven’t started burried yet, but we did do a few container sessions. I used 4 switch boxes instead of the cardboard boxes for these. Thankfully no paw smashing, but there were a few false alerts during the first session. I think because in the beginning there was so much emphasis on rewarding for the nose in the “hole”, that he was doing that hoping to be rewarded lol. Or maybe just thought that was the “game”. I just ignored those and waited until he found the container with the odor and rewarded heavily. During the second session there were no more false alerts! We will probably do one more session with the switch boxes then move back to cardboard boxes and see how that goes. I have also been using the cones at the start line like @Ravenbird suggested!

I was originally going to enter a trial that’s in 2 weeks, but I decided just to show and do FastCat instead. We will now be trialing in October! It’s on the 19th and 20th although I haven’t decided if I’m going to enter both days. (It’s 3ish hours away so I’d need to stay at a hotel at least one night.) All 4 elements are being offered. You can trial in each element twice on the first day and once on the second day.

I’ll try to update again soon with a video!

 

[Ravenbird]

Sounds like a great training day!

emphasis on rewarding for the nose in the “hole”, that he was doing that hoping to be rewarded lol. Or maybe just thought that was the “game”

This is kind of like what Asha did early in training containers. It was more like a multiple choice than using her nose. It was tough to get through that stage because (looking back now) I think she thought the game was "pick one and eventually you'll get it right and win". Hopefully Remy will move on from that thought quicker than Asha did! Be aware that buried presents the same picture as container boxes (multiple choice, he will figure out that it's one of the matching boxes).

You'll be less stressed to just do show & Fast Cat one weekend and October do only scent work. I think that's a great idea. If the Sunday trials are early you can do the 3rd set of runs and still be back home for supper!

 

[remy]

Sounds like a great training day!

It was fun!

This is kind of like what Asha did early in training containers. It was more like a multiple choice than using her nose. It was tough to get through that stage because (looking back now) I think she thought the game was "pick one and eventually you'll get it right and win". Hopefully Remy will move on from that thought quicker than Asha did! Be aware that buried presents the same picture as container boxes (multiple choice, he will figure out that it's one of the matching boxes).

I’m hoping he moves past it. He did much better during the second session so let’s hope it stay that way lol!

You'll be less stressed to just do show & Fast Cat one weekend and October do only scent work. I think that's a great idea. If the Sunday trials are early you can do the 3rd set of runs and still be back home for supper!

I think so too! I’m already a little stressed to be handling him myself, so it’s probably better that we aren’t trying a new sport that weekend too. Don’t get me wrong, I do love showing (and training for it) I just get really nervous in the ring still!

I do have a few things planned this fall across different sports, but nothing on the same day/weekend (besides one day with show & fcat). I feel like it’s enough to keep using busy but not too much to get burned out…

•August 31st & September 1st: show and fcat one day
•September 20th or 21st: barn hunt
•October 12th & 13th: show
•October 19th & (possibly) 20th: scent work
•November 15th(?): fastcat

There are a lot of other events I could do in November (scent work, barn hunt, show) but we’ll see how these couple of months go first…

 

[Ravenbird]

Your planning sounds perfect. Fast Cat is like a stress-reliever for both of you, at least it is for me (except finding someone to hold Asha at the start). I think most everyone is nervous to an extent when they enter a ring, especially at first. Scent Work and BH will be way less stressful I think than showing, it's more fun and way more casual in dress & attitude than show & obedience. I was SO happy last year after our first obedience trial that they were doing day-of sign ups for Fast Cat. I "bought a ticket" for Asha as a reward for putting up with my nerves and not knowing what I was doing for my very first time at a big cluster show. If I go back in November for Open, I'll try to do Fast Cat at the end of every day. I love following your adventures!!!

 

[remy]

Thoughts on this harness for scent work? I want to get something different so it’s not the same one he wears on the bike and longline walks… I also like that it has a handle.

Leerburg | Tracking Harness with Handle

Amish handmade harness with latigo leather. They are soft and flexible, and adjustable to fit most working dog.

leerburg.com

 

[JanS]

Thoughts on this harness for scent work? I want to get something different so it’s not the same one he wears on the bike and longline walks…

I haven't dabbled in scent work yet but that looks like a nice one. I was talking to a bunch of scent work people at a show and they only use one specific one for it so they know they need to do that when it goes on.

 

[Ravenbird]

Thoughts on this harness for scent work? I want to get something different so it’s not the same one he wears on the bike and longline walks… I also like that it has a handle.

It's a nice quality harness, but a bit overkill for scent work in my opinion. It's probably heavier than you need - it's built for pulling/leaning into in human tracking for real or for man-trailing sport. In scent work the dog should have freedom to search and you won't be holding Remy back so you won't need a pulling harness. It definitely wouldn't hurt anything, but it's just "a lot" of harness.

I only use a harness to indicate to Asha that "we are now doing scent work", it's a lightweight thing, I don't have to put a leg through it, just over the neck and bring the girth belt around, very quick and easy. Yes, it has the strap in front that I'd prefer to be a v shape, but to run freely around for 10 seconds to 4 minutes in trial it won't hurt anything. It also has a handle on it that I use a LOT when taking her from crate to waiting area to search area at a trial. I do have a really nice heavy duty harness for bite work that she can lay into and not hurt herself and boy when I bring that one out she knows exactly what we're doing! They become very collar (or harness) savvy if you stay dedicated to wearing a specific item every single time you do a specific training.

this is what I use for scent work and I've had the same one since she was 8 months old! A little adjustment as she matured and it still fits!

https://www.chewy.com/comfortflex-fully-padded-non-chafing/dp/355891

This is her bite work harness (if you like really nice leather goods, you'll like this site) I got her WAE collar here too:

The Boss | Leather Agitation Harness | Premium Leather Dog Harness | Dean & Tyler

This agitation dog harness is made from premium full-grain leather. It comes with an optional handle. Order The Boss agitation harness from Dean & Tyler!

www.dtdogcollars.com

 

[remy]

It's a nice quality harness, but a bit overkill for scent work in my opinion. It's probably heavier than you need - it's built for pulling/leaning into in human tracking for real or for man-trailing sport. In scent work the dog should have freedom to search and you won't be holding Remy back so you won't need a pulling harness. It definitely wouldn't hurt anything, but it's just "a lot" of harness.

I only use a harness to indicate to Asha that "we are now doing scent work", it's a lightweight thing, I don't have to put a leg through it, just over the neck and bring the girth belt around, very quick and easy. Yes, it has the strap in front that I'd prefer to be a v shape, but to run freely around for 10 seconds to 4 minutes in trial it won't hurt anything. It also has a handle on it that I use a LOT when taking her from crate to waiting area to search area at a trial. I do have a really nice heavy duty harness for bite work that she can lay into and not hurt herself and boy when I bring that one out she knows exactly what we're doing! They become very collar (or harness) savvy if you stay dedicated to wearing a specific item every single time you do a specific training.

this is what I use for scent work and I've had the same one since she was 8 months old! A little adjustment as she matured and it still fits!

https://www.chewy.com/comfortflex-fully-padded-non-chafing/dp/355891

This is her bite work harness (if you like really nice leather goods, you'll like this site) I got her WAE collar here too:

The Boss | Leather Agitation Harness | Premium Leather Dog Harness | Dean & Tyler

This agitation dog harness is made from premium full-grain leather. It comes with an optional handle. Order The Boss agitation harness from Dean & Tyler!

www.dtdogcollars.com

Thank you! I prefer the “y” front also, but like you said, they aren’t wearing it long anyways. A lot of people recommend the K-9 Julius(?) harness but I wasn’t sure I liked the strap across the chest.

I just want something that feels somewhat different on (than what he has) to help associate it with scent work, so maybe that type of harness would be better after all lol.

This looks like what he has now but a different brand.

 

[JanS]

A lot of people recommend the K-9 Julius(?) harness

I got a Julius K-9 for Olive if we can ever start the nosework class.

 

[Ravenbird]

I just want something that feels somewhat different on (than what he has) to help associate it with scent work, so maybe that type of harness would be better after all lol.

It really doesn't matter, you can get what you like the best. Many just use a collar and don't change up anything to train. It's just how I was started and I never changed and I do think anything to help the dog understand what's expected is helpful to training!. Also in the last year or so for the first time I have done searches on my hikes and she has her Hunter Orange flat collar with bear bells and an e-collar on. She knows to search anyway.

 

[Rits]

I'd go for a Y harness if at all possible. If you want to spend the money on that nice tracking harness, go for it!

 

[remy]

I'd go for a Y harness if at all possible.

That’s what I would prefer! Just trying to see what my options are.

If you want to spend the money on that nice tracking harness, go for it!

I don’t mind the price, just don’t want to buy it if it’s not really what’s needed for scent work. I do like that it has a handle and is leather though.