Ear post question

[DobieJo]

Don’t worry about your questions…I think I asked 5 everyday and wanted to ask 10 but refrained from appearing idiotic psychotic.

As far as the ears go…if you have them deep in the ears and secure with tape then everything else will take care of themselves. I use to push Ragnar’s down all the way to bottom of bell.

As far as too far forward/backward, 11/1, 10/2….ehhh, this is a good guideline but once the bridge is off and they establish individual ear control, I believe it’s really up to the Doberman to finish the job. You are not holding the ears at 11/1 without a bridge and they stay out of the bridge longer than they are in it.

I think the initial weeks with the bridge is the basic support foundation getting strong in prep to go independent without the bridge. If all that makes sense.

TLDR…
Don’t fret about it, if you are doing it right structure wise- then it will be okay in the long run.

Basic principles
1. Not too tight q with tape
2. Change often
3. Take bridge off once establish indiv ear control
4. Don’t get stupid and stop posting. Post through teething
5. Don’t test ears until close to finish teething
6. Never let Doberman sleep out of post unless absolutely sure the ears won’t break/crease.
7. Post yourself- not the vet

Oh thank you so much! I feel better knowing I’m not appearing crazy with all these questions! lol

With that said (lol) I only used a bridge for a week, two, 3 day postings. Should I be using it longer? She seems to have decent control over her bases, but, then again, I’m new at this, so maybe it’s not good enough to stop bridging just yet? She will perk her ears up when I make a squeaky noise, but only for a minute or so, then relax them afterwards.
So maybe I took the bridge off too soon?
I just have read articles that say leaving the bridge on to long can be worse than taking it off to early, but being new to posting, I have no idea if I’m to early or to late with it?!

What I mean by her ears being forward, is after they are posted w/o the bridge, both ears fall forward some, out towards her eyes/muzzle, not outward towards the sides of her head. So should I be putting the bridge back on? Will that stop them from falling forward or is that even an issue if they do that? I just don’t want them to obviously lean forward like that after they’ve completely done w/posting, if that will happen?

 

[Ravenbird]

What I mean by her ears being forward, is after they are posted w/o the bridge, both ears fall forward some, out towards her eyes/muzzle, not outward towards the sides of her head.

Any time you are unsure of what you're seeing, take a photo and post it here. Your description is good, but photo would be better. We could more easily determine if it's just relaxing or if it's "not quite right".

Also, you cannot get the posts too deep! The ear canal is L shaped so if you push the post to the bottom, it can only hit the floor of the ear, can't go in towards sensitive parts! If your backer rod post is too fat for a young puppy it won't seat down far enough and then the ear will just hang onto the loose post, perhaps flopping forward. That's why I'm curious to see a photo. If that's the case (not seating the post deep enough) and the rod is too fat, you can just narrow it down with scissors so it fits deeper. Or it might be if you are putting a cotton ball down first that would be the reason the rod doesn't seat deep.

Keep asking questions, it's not only helpful to you, it's helpful to others who are learning!

 

[Ddski5]

When the bridge comes off you can expect the ears to individually flop around a lot. What needs to happen though, is they have the ability to control ears into the erect, vertical position.

Now, of course, they will not hold the erect position long because they will not be in alert, focused demeanor for long periods of time.

The problem with keeping a bridge on too long is that it takes away from the individual ears getting stronger themselves- the bridge is doing the job. Also, it causes pockets thus creating t-pee triangle of the ears.

 

[DobieJo]

Any time you are unsure of what you're seeing, take a photo and post it here. Your description is good, but photo would be better. We could more easily determine if it's just relaxing or if it's "not quite right".

Also, you cannot get the posts too deep! The ear canal is L shaped so if you push the post to the bottom, it can only hit the floor of the ear, can't go in towards sensitive parts! If your backer rod post is too fat for a young puppy it won't seat down far enough and then the ear will just hang onto the loose post, perhaps flopping forward. That's why I'm curious to see a photo. If that's the case (not seating the post deep enough) and the rod is too fat, you can just narrow it down with scissors so it fits deeper. Or it might be if you are putting a cotton ball down first that would be the reason the rod doesn't seat deep.

Keep asking questions, it's not only helpful to you, it's helpful to others who are learning!

Thank you for the help!
We are using 1/2 in backer rod with cotton on the bottom, the post are staying in, not coming out, they just lean very far forward without the bridge. I only used the bridge for a week, should I have used it longer? Or is the backer rod maybe too heavy for her?

Without the bridge on, if I make a high pitched noise, she can hold her ears erect, so does that mean she doesn’t need the bridge anymore? I just wasn’t sure since she only wore it for one week? So I figured with the way her ears were leaning so far forward I either needed to bridge longer or use a smaller backer rod…or maybe I’m not getting the post in straight? Is that a possibility too?

 

[DobieJo]

When the bridge comes off you can expect the ears to individually flop around a lot. What needs to happen though, is they have the ability to control ears into the erect, vertical position.

Now, of course, they will not hold the erect position long because they will not be in alert, focused demeanor for long periods of time.

The problem with keeping a bridge on too long is that it takes away from the individual ears getting stronger themselves- the bridge is doing the job. Also, it causes pockets thus creating t-pee triangle of the ears.
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Thank you for the helpful advice!
With the bridge off, she definitely flops, mostly forward, if I make a squeaky sound she definitely erects her ears, but I’m afraid with her being 12 weeks and only using the bridge for a week, her ears will start to “form” laying forward, if that can happen?
I also am not sure if I’m using the correct backer rod size, Im posting her with 1/2 inch with cotton on the ear end, the post doesn’t come out of her ear at all, but they definitely do not stand similar to the pic of the pup you posted. They lean so much more forward without the bridge, so I’m wondering if I either need a smaller backer rod or does she need to wear the bridge more than just the one week she did? My husband actually put a “tape bridge” on her early this morning because he was worried about her ears.
So this point, we are unsure about how to proceed, bridge? Smaller backer rod? Or am I the one leaning the rod forward? I don’t think I am, but ?
Here’s a pic of her with the tape bridge my husband put on her this morning… I don’t want to bridge if I shouldn’t be, but I also don’t want to remove it if she’s not ready.
It’s not the best pic, she is playing outside and didn’t want to sit still lol

 

[JanS]

Without the bridge on, if I make a high pitched noise, she can hold her ears erect, so does that mean she doesn’t need the bridge anymore?

I would say so and as stated, they have a lot of positions they can hold them in.

Or is the backer rod maybe too heavy for her?

No it shouldn't be, or at least I've never seen it.

I figured with the way her ears were leaning so far forward I either needed to bridge longer or use a smaller backer rod…or maybe I’m not getting the post in straight? Is that a possibility too?

I've never used backer rod smaller than 1/2" so I doubt that's it. Our almost 5 month old just went up to 5/8" and that seems to be holding them much straighter when they were wanting to pull in with 1/2".

As for posting them straight, they should be straight as long as they're seated in the canal well but it can make a difference on how you stretch them up and place the ear itself.

 

[Ddski5]

Not to be rude…but you are really over thinking this- looking back on it, I did the same on my first one too hahah!

You feel more comfortable leaving the bridge on for another week? Then keep it on…no worries. It’s not gonna make or break the ears. But in that picture, the ears are erect and there is slack in the bridge which means your pup has adequate ear strength/control.

Do with what you are comfortable with and go with your gut. Just can’t keep the bridge on for weeks/months at a time.

 

[Rits]

As @Ddski5 said, don't worry so much about the bridge. If it helps the ears from falling forward then leave it on. There is no set way how you "MUST" post. Some people bridge the entire time (my breeder) and have no issues. Just have to be careful to not bridge them too tight once they have control as that can create pockets. Putting a cotton ball in the base of the ear between the post and ear can push the pocket out if there are any. I did that with my current pups first few posts to really get a nice solid shaped base.

The biggest damage you can do to the ears is leaving them out of posts overnight and allowing them to sleep on them. I think you will be fine

 

[Ravenbird]

I agree with all the statements given, but looking at your photo I have one question: how much longer are the posts than her ears? Black on black I can't tell but if they are much longer than her ears they could possibly make them top heavy and contribute to leaning forward? Just a thought. But mostly I agree with "don't over think it". You will be fine and her ears will be beautiful!

 

[DobieJo]

Thank you all so much for your advice.
I’m sure I’m overthinking/worrying about this. It’s my first pup and so I’m just nervous I’m not doing something I should be or doing something I shouldn’t be! lol

I appreciate all the advice! It really is so helpful to me to know I’m using the right size backer rod and that leaving the bridge on or taking it off won’t make it break the outcome, (unless it’s to taunt, which I don’t think it is)

I do have another question about posting, (shocking I know) Does the post go in the deep back canal of her ear or just straight down? I’ve been putting it in the deep back part and just want to make sure that’s where it should be. I don’t believe she’s formed any pockets, at least I don’t think so, heck I’m not even sure if I know what exactly a eat pocket looks like?!

I’m going to try and relax about the posting process, I really do appreciate all the helpful advice from you all, it does helps ease my mind about wether I’m doing things correctly. I know there’s several ways and methods to post, but for a newbie who just wants to make sure her ears turn out nice, it all can be just so overwhelming.
Thank you all again!!

 

[DobieJo]

I agree with all the statements given, but looking at your photo I have one question: how much longer are the posts than her ears? Black on black I can't tell but if they are much longer than her ears they could possibly make them top heavy and contribute to leaning forward? Just a thought. But mostly I agree with "don't over think it". You will be fine and her ears will be beautiful!

Thank you, I appreciate any help!
I try and cut the post about a 1/4 inch above her ear tip, I’m so afraid to go any shorter for fear of cutting her ear tips, especially since she’s such a wiggle butt while posting.
Is that to ok or should I try to cut the post as close to her ear too as possible?
I also am not sure if the placement is where it should be, I put it on there deep back pocket, but maybe a a it should just go straight down? Here’s a pic…

 

[Ravenbird]

I try and cut the post about a 1/4 inch above her ear tip

That's perfect. I was afraid they might be an inch or so higher than the tip. You're good.

 

[Ravenbird]

Placement looks good to me. When you get comfortable with it, try just one piece of tape lower and higher without multiple wraps. Do you have a long show crop?

 

[Rits]

Thank you, I appreciate any help!
I try and cut the post about a 1/4 inch above her ear tip, I’m so afraid to go any shorter for fear of cutting her ear tips, especially since she’s such a wiggle butt while posting.
Is that to ok or should I try to cut the post as close to her ear too as possible?
I also am not sure if the placement is where it should be, I put it on there deep back pocket, but maybe a a it should just go straight down? Here’s a pic…

They look good where they are as far as seated in her ear, especially if she doesn't shake them out.

Question for you now, hah! Are you taping the backerrod with duct tape or backtaping it at all? I think I see bare backer rod? Covering it with duct tape or zonas tape helps firm the post up and make it a lot more rigid. Less likely they'll bend or fall forward if you do.

 

[Ddski5]

Wow…if she is not backtaping the backerrod then she is an absolute pro or her pup is awesome!!! I think some trolling and sandbagging is going on here!!

I had to cram backtaped backerrod down deep to get them to stay in Rag and Freyja.

 

[JanS]

if she is not backtaping the backerrod then she is an absolute pro or her pup is awesome!!!

I'm on a regular PC and zoomed in, it does look backtaped. Apparently Zona's makes black tape now too.

 

[Rits]

I'm on a regular PC and zoomed in, it does look backtaped. Apparently Zona's makes black tape now too.

This is why I asked because I thought I saw bare backerrod here but could still be back taped and the other side of the tape is lighter! Just wanted to be sure

 

[DobieJo]

Placement looks good to me. When you get comfortable with it, try just one piece of tape lower and higher without multiple wraps. Do you have a long show crop?

Thanks Ravenbird, I wasn’t sure if I was placing it to far back, I thought that could be the reason her ears were leaning forward some.

She gets reposted Saturday evening, I’ll try using just one piece of tape at the top/bottom

Her cut is a medium long, according to
Dr Midgarden, who did the crop.

 

[DobieJo]

They look good where they are as far as seated in her ear, especially if she doesn't shake them out.

Question for you now, hah! Are you taping the backerrod with duct tape or backtaping it at all? I think I see bare backer rod? Covering it with duct tape or zonas tape helps firm the post up and make it a lot more rigid. Less likely they'll bend or fall forward if you do.

Yes, we wrapped the backer rod with duct tape 3x and then we back taped it as well. The tape we are using to back tape is black so I’m sure it’s hard to differentiate what’s what. lol

 

[Ravenbird]

Dr Midgarden, who did the crop.

I hear you can't get any better than that! Lucky you!