Dog Parks and Psychological Benefits?

[StateOfMine]

Okay I am treading carefully now.... So it seems like there is a lot of mixed information out there about dog parks and a dog's psychological needs. I see just as many people against dog parks as I see people encouraging it. I understand both sides, I think? Do the benefits outweigh the potential drawbacks? I watch a channel on youtube called Beckman's Dog Training. He uses a doberman pinscher (two, actually, but not at the same time) to help him rehabilitate dog reactive dogs. He achieved this by socializing his dogs wit other dogs and is always talking about how dogs help correct behavior issues that humans can't. Here is one link, feel free to go through his videos:

Beckman's Dog Training

I personally, love how calm and non-reactive Boscoe is. Dogs coming at him with bared teeth and he just stares at them like "Pfft okay dude. Calm down." His owner has trained him and another doberman named Prince. Prince is slightly more reactive to being challenged, but overall keeps a similar calm composure and listens very well. Anyway, in other videos, Joel talks about puppy stages where they jump and nip to let them have other puppy friends to get all of this jumping and biting out and give it somewhere to go. He claims it makes the dobershark stage much more mild if they have somewhere for it to go other than you. He claims it has other benefits, like they drain each other of energy and it fulfills a psychological need that human interaction can't give them.


There is a lot more, but seeing how his dobermans handle other dogs, even reactive ones, makes me wonder if all of these claims to avoid dog parks entirely are the right call. I can understand observing a situation and seeing troublesome dogs from afar where you'd just avoid the dog park for that day would make sense, but is there really absolutely no benefit to dog parks? Are the benefits not worth the risks?

 

[Doberman Gang]

Sorry, not a fan of this guy. I have watch a few of his videos. They may be impressive to the pet people but he is not. His advice find a big calm dog in your neighborhood tobisecto correct your reactive dog is a joke. The video he shows first a small dog with his Doberman, the small dog is nervous and the big dog doesn’t back down or react. This is a controlled situation he is not in a public park. What if it was another big Doberman that is typically good around other dogs but then the small reactive dog comes up showing teeth nipping. If the Doberman snaps back to put the little dog in its place, now the little dogs owner freaks out and labels the Doberman as being aggressive. It’s a no win situation. All of his videos are staged like this. The 2nd dog is a red Doberman, totally just trying to play with his dog. The dogs tail is wagging and goes into play stance multiple times. It was not being reactive only trying to play.

 

[Doberman Gang]

 

[Ravenbird]

What @Doberman Gang said and his video of Michael Ellis shows. I've stated my position on dog parks many times here and nothing will change my mind.

The Doberman breed especially wants nothing more than to be close to their human. Your biggest favor to them would be to spend 30 minutes to an hour in a group obedience class where all the pups are under control, so you get exposure to working around other dogs/people. Your dog will consider it an outing with you, not strange dogs. As your puppy gets older add different challenges with your classes: nose work, agility, rally, whatever. Find what your dog loves to do, even if it's just hiking together. You get a Doberman because you want a companion and best friend. Be that.

 

[EricA]

Your biggest favor to them would be to spend 30 minutes to an hour in a group obedience class where all the pups are under control, so you get exposure to working around other dogs/people. Your dog will consider it an outing with you, not strange dogs. As your puppy gets older add different challenges with your classes: nose work, agility, rally, whatever. Find what your dog loves to do, even if it's just hiking together. You get a Doberman because you want a companion and best friend. Be that.

In the real world - Not every dog you come across is going to be 'under control'. Far from it.

Your fido is NOT going to learn how to interact with the dogs on the other side of the fence if they are always on the other side of the fence.

 

[EricA]

Okay I am treading carefully now.... So it seems like there is a lot of mixed information out there about dog parks and a dog's psychological needs.

Never, ever take fido anxiety advice from someone that has their dog wearing a thunder coat (or that has their fido on prosac).

 

[Ddski5]

That’s a great video and exactly how I desensitized Ragnar from being very reactive to other dogs. Rag still bows up and starts deep breathing but does not launch or go into a heightened drive anymore. I see it before it happens and get him to engage me rather that the other dogs.

I don’t feel like it’s mine that I worry about- I am in control. It’s the other dogs in which the owner has zero control (at least they think they do). And what about that crazy arse owner that takes his pit or Akita to the park to see which dogs arse he can kick this weekend? Some people are nuts and thrive off this…

I learned, on this site, that Dobermans tend to go through fear stages and to be greatly aware of these stages. What happens if your Doberman is having fun in the dog park, you are casually having fun too, and an aggressive dominant dog comes at your Doberman? Then your Doberman becomes overly fearful and scared/reactive of other dogs. Even worse, this is most likely going to create other unwanted fearful situations with your Doberman- loud noises, quick motions, new people, trucks, etc…

Always been a firm believer to control what you can control and move on from there. Really can’t control actions of other dogs and owners in a dog park. But you can outside the fence.

In soccer we have a phrase that I teach.
“Is the risk really worth the reward?”

Have a player that plays with the ball in front of the goal, in order to look skillful. Sure, she may look good but one mistake and boom the other team is right there to hit the ball in the net five feet away. Just get the ball out- the risk is not worth the reward. Either way the players job is to get the ball out of the box. One unwise decision can lead to bad consequences and the game is lost.

The risk is not worth the reward in the dog park.

 

[Kaiser2016]

This is a controlled situation he is not in a public park.

This is a key detail! He knows who his dogs are. He will also muzzle visiting dogs until he figures them out. This is part of risk management that can’t happen in a public park.

Dog parks can be dangerous especially during a Dobermans formative years to maturity, and then the fear periods of a puppy. If bad things happen at the wrong time, you can be dealing with lifelong reactivity. I think owning a Doberman is hard enough without adding the extra challenge of managing a wild party of unknown dogs. Dogs will operate in packs to take on your dog, there will be at least one bully dog present whose owner won’t care, then there are the super sensitive types who think a loud Doberman bark means the dog is aggressive lol. And then there’s your dog in the mix. With all the effort and intensity of training a Doberman, you just won’t want to put it at risk.

Play dates with known dogs though? Love that idea. It’s a great way to get the energy out and we did do that a lot in the beginning. But all those dogs were known to us and we were known to each other - no surprises.

 

[Ddski5]

Your fido is NOT going to learn how to interact with the dogs on the other side of the fence if they are always on the other side of the fence.

I can understand this to a point but my Dobermans do not play/interact with other unknown dogs. I would rather them to be confident and in control with me.

We do have neighborhood dogs. A Catahoula cur on my right and a German Shepherd and Rott on the right. We let them play together sometimes only because I know these other dogs. Dogs at a public dog park and a stranger come in with an aggressive breed? or not an agressive breed but a small yippie dog that just won’t shut up bantering my Dobermans. “Oh, little Molly is just having fun with your Dobermans”. I can tell you right now, Ragnar and Freyja will not tolerate that shat.

Uhhh…rather not.

 

[Firestar Dobe]

Dog parks my sound like the perfect solution to a myriad of issues. That is not always true. Most people don't realize the high risk involved. If your dog is attacked and injured, you cannot sue. If your dog has been properly taken care of by a Vet, that doesn't mean all the dogs at the park are up to date on shots, dewormings, etc. My girls were way to valuable and loved for us to risk the dangers of a dog park. If you feel you must go to a dog park, then stay outside the park where your dog can see, but not interact with the other dogs. It only takes 1 aggressive dog, or 1 dog that isn't cared for properly for your world to turn upside down. Socialization for a dog is not going to a play date or a party. That is human socialization. Dog socialization is being able to walk your dog anywhere with the confidence that he/she will ignore other dogs and people unless you say differently. The best way to socialize and overcome issues with your dog is through constant training. There is no better way to teach your dog or to bond with your dog then training constantly in everyday life!

 

[Kaiser2016]

small yippie dog that just won’t shut up bantering my Dobermans. “Oh, little Molly is just having fun with your Dobermans”. I can tell you right now, Ragnar and Freyja will not tolerate that shat.

Kaiser has had so many little off leash dogs run up to him when he was a younger dog. He would just stare down at them like what’s your problem? Nowadays he will roll them over and use his paw to hold them down lol. Have to wonder if that’s enough to teach those little critters their lesson! He has no tolerance for that behavior and he didn’t need to learn that at a dog park.

 

[StateOfMine]

I've been unsure about dog parks myself but wanted to hear from others. I do know my plan was, if I go to one, the instant any pit bull or pit bull type showed up, me and my dog are out. "Its all in how you raise them" is the biggest lie ever told (sorry to pit bull/bully fans but its true). Love doesn't undo generations upon generations of breeding and concentrated blood built for "gameness". Unfortunately too many people who have no business having a pit bull, have at least one, and they're a pain in the ass for everyone including the owner on the best of days, a death and a lawsuit on the worst.

Sorry someone mentioned pit bull and that's my immediate thought that I need to get out.

There is a bar in my area that allows dogs as long as they are on a leash at all times and well behaved. I've seen labs and smaller dogs mostly, but I have seen two German shepherds too. Everyone in there seemed fairly mellow and I'd like to bring my doberman when he's done getting all of his puppy shots. I planned on earning a CGC title too, but would that be enough to get my dog to behave himself in a setting like that?

The tables are far apart for safety. Dogs are not allowed at the bar itself as they are a tripping hazard. Would this be a better alternative than a dog park then?

 

[Ddski5]

Sorry someone mentioned pit bull and that's my immediate thought that I need to get out.

I know, sorry about that…I really don’t like to stereotype Pits. I am sure there are some wonderful Pits out there. But, when I read the news about dog attacks, just about every week nowadays- dogs killing children and even adults, it seems 8/10 of them are Pits. I guess mass media conditions me in that aspect for I have never had a negative situation with a Pit. I’ve had two situations with Akitas and they were just aggressively dominant.

 

[StateOfMine]

I know, sorry about that…I really don’t like to stereotype Pits. I am sure there are some wonderful Pits out there. But, when I read the news about dog attacks, just about every week nowadays- dogs killing children and even adults, it seems 8/10 of them are Pits. I guess mass media conditions me in that aspect for I have never had a negative situation with a Pit. I’ve had two situations with Akitas and they were just aggressively dominant.

Stereotypes exist for a reason. I've had good experiences with pits myself, but I've also seen what they can do at the drop of a hat. They get stimulated very quickly, and what would be normal levels of stimulation for one dog will send a pit over the edge and they take a long time to calm back down. They were bred this way for a long time and I believe only people who intend to use them for some kind of work (like hog hunting) should have them. I know that's a slippery slope too though, given dobermans and their own history.

 

[Doberman Gang]

I believe it was Micheal Ellis or possibly Ivan Balabanov that were talking about how socialization of dogs and especially puppies have gone so far overboard that it is causing more problems than good. These are at times when puppies need to really learn and observe to become confident good dogs. But people are creating over stimulated nerve bags. Might have been Ivan I was just with him at AWDF Championship a week and a half ago. It is crazy how things can get so misconstrued when it comes to their dogs and socializing.

 

[Ddski5]

It is crazy how things can get so misconstrued when it comes to their dogs and socializing.

Can you give some examples? Be honest too, hell you can even use me and my two if it’s there- won’t hurt my feelings.

 

[Rits]

Given that dobermans are often dog reactive by nature... dog parks are not a good idea. Great idea if you want to spend thousands in training trying to fix your now super reactive or now fearful dog. Not including medical costs or maybe your dog gets confiscated because it's a doberman, doesn't matter if that jack Russell started it. Same sex aggression is very prevalent in this breed. My dogs are also intact. There is a natural reason dogs see intact dogs as a threat. Ever seen a wild stallion with their herd meet an approaching stallion? They are never being friends. Now take this same logic with an intact dog and "their pack" at the dog park and another intact dog comes in.

Likened to not wearing an ecollar off leash when there are bunnies, deer, cars, neighbor walks onto your property etc so many uncontrolled factors. Can my dog recall without one? Yep. Just tested this yesterday on accident when I couldn't get the damn remote out of my pocket (now going on a lanyard around my neck). My good girl recalled right away. But 9x/10... there's always that one time...and all it takes is that one time. Can you go to a dog park and everything is fine? Sure. But in reality when you think of the consequences if something happened, it is not worth the risk!!! And with a dog park there are so many moving parts, variables and chances for something to happen the odds feel higher. We have to be proactive to protect our dogs, especially this breed.

I haven't stepped foot in a dog park with my dobermans. And yet, my dogs can play with other dogs! They do not need a dog park to be "socialized" (rather for socialized I think the better word is desensitized) or to know how to play with other dogs. They learned this from their mother and littermates.

 

[Doberman Gang]

What I meant was, people continue to instruct other puppy owners or new dog owners on the importance of socialization of their dogs. Take them everywhere, have strangers give them treats, get them to play with dogs they don’t know ect… this all to the extreme and to the point dogs are over stimulated and stressed but most people don’t see the warning signs, just believe they are doing what is best for the puppy or dog. It ends up causing problems as the dog gets older.

 

[Ravenbird]

There is a bar in my area that allows dogs as long as they are on a leash at all times and well behaved. I've seen labs and smaller dogs mostly, but I have seen two German shepherds too. Everyone in there seemed fairly mellow and I'd like to bring my doberman when he's done getting all of his puppy shots. I planned on earning a CGC title too, but would that be enough to get my dog to behave himself in a setting like that?

CGC is all well and good, my puppy passed that test at about 9 months old. But what you are looking at, to take your dog to dog friendly bars or patio restaurants is training across the board, mostly that you are the most important thing, that your dog respects you and all you stand for. That's the main reason that exposure to dog parks and doggy day care where your puppy is having a blast with all these dogs doesn't work in the long run, even if there are no bad incidents. You train your dog and all your training (and rewards! and food!) come from you. Your puppy begins to look to you as the Best Thing. So when you go sit with your friends at the bar your dog is not thinking about playing with the other dogs, your dog is just happy that it's with you. Neutral to all people and dogs is the goal.

My dog has never seen the inside of a dog park but we go to dog friendly restaurants, off-leash hikes with other dogs, can down stay off leash with distractions, etc. YOU teach the dog to do these things! Dog parks at their very best just teach a dog that other stuff is more fun than you are.

 

[Kswoodssue]

i have had dogs my entire life. I promise you that if you feed, and train and care for your dog, he/she will be perfectly happy to have you as his best friend for his whole life. It wasn’t that long ago that dog parks didn’t even exist. My advice is to relax. Don’t believe everything you see on Utube, and always remember that sometimes very bad people hang at dog parks. Child molesters have often used dogs to lure children. Sex offenders too. I know, because I worked out patient mental health the last 11 yrs of my nursing career and they told me. …Of course, most folks at the park are fine, but just because they have a dog doesn’t mean they know anything about them, and I guarantee that NO person there has complete control over their dog while it is running loose. Other than all of that, your dog might enjoy it.