What do you think?

BG1

BG1

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Browsing for breed info on youts-toob and this popped up in my feed:


I appreciate the hosts intentions and the entertainment value...
I wonder a bit about a couple of the subjects decisions on training...and deployment...

There seem to be more dobe folk here with working dog or LEO experience. Whats your take on the ATM example, for example?

Just curious, no agenda here other than discussion- thanks in advance. (TIA)
 
It’s pretty factual but one must realize when having protection Dobermans you have to stay on top of training daily.
Legend still has once a week training with his protection work trainer.

The ATM is a place I always have mine with me. They are never off lead though. I have a quick release traffic tab on them in the event I should ever need to give a command to attack. I will give the alert command once I get out of my truck so they are all business.
They both are trained to hand signals and whistles.

Breaking into our home would never happen because they will know the moment you try to trespass on our property and respond immediately. We are on 5 acres with our house at the base of a rain forest, they know whether it’s an animal or human and you will know by how they act and by their bark.
It will chill your spine to hear their growling bark if it’s a human.
I never want to experience a car jacking again. It’s pure fear and adrenaline pumping and you always worry about your dobe being harmed.
All I want at home is for them to alert me and I can take it from there.
Normally bright motion detection lights and them barking will prevent an intruder from gaining access to our home.
It doesn’t hurt having a horse that will alert you to someone on the property.😂
 
That's the Animal Watch woman. I have seen a vid on Dobes that she did, and I wonder if this is it.

I enjoy watching her vids pretty well, but I find they are not, well let's say they don't seem to have quite the level of information that we share around here at DCF.

I do know that she feels she must get her anti-cropping comments in.
 
Oh Little Oji said:
That's the Animal Watch woman. I have seen a vid on Dobes that she did, and I wonder if this is it.

I enjoy watching her vids pretty well, but I find they are not, well let's say they don't seem to have quite the level of information that we share around here at DCF.

I do know that she feels she must get her anti-cropping comments in.
Click to expand...
They called the uncropped Doberman a Ble. It sure looks like a Fawn to me.
 
I sure admire the level of the dog's training, and the efforts the owner is putting in. I don't want a protection dog, but I am a 52 year old male, and the nicest things I own are my Dobermans, so risk for me becoming a victim is quite low (there is also not a lot of crime where I live). I think Creed's owner lives in a very different environment than me and has a much higher risk of becoming a victim. I can see it, for her, letting the dog make it's own choices at the ATM, It's a situation where you are pretty focused and might not have the ability to look around. I bet those with bad intentions quickly reconsider when they see a Doberman, and just the dog's presence is a prevention.

I enjoy the Animal Watch stuff. In my opinion they do a pretty good job of light education for the masses, but I wouldn't ask them about more complex or deeper questions about the breed. It's a decent source for someone who never owned a certain breed, but saw one on the street one day, and wanted to start learning.
 
Katyusharocket said:
I sure admire the level of the dog's training, and the efforts the owner is putting in. I don't want a protection dog, but I am a 52 year old male, and the nicest things I own are my Dobermans, so risk for me becoming a victim is quite low (there is also not a lot of crime where I live). I think Creed's owner lives in a very different environment than me and has a much higher risk of becoming a victim. I can see it, for her, letting the dog make it's own choices at the ATM, It's a situation where you are pretty focused and might not have the ability to look around. I bet those with bad intentions quickly reconsider when they see a Doberman, and just the dog's presence is a prevention.

I enjoy the Animal Watch stuff. In my opinion they do a pretty good job of light education for the masses, but I wouldn't ask them about more complex or deeper questions about the breed. It's a decent source for someone who never owned a certain breed, but saw one on the street one day, and wanted to start learning.
Click to expand...
Well said. General education is always good, even if I might quibble with a couple of things.

As an aside, I've met many young women at dogparks over the last couple years who have said they got a dog to help with past trauma, safety issues.

Seemed like "Scary big black dog privilege" was a meme for awhile- social media wannabe influencers upgrading from french bullies or?

Its a fashion thing for some breeds. But a genuine benefit on the risk/reward spectrum if the dog is well trained.

I wonder if dobes are on the upswing, in popularity in general (saw a cite somewhere as recent as 2022 that dobes are #15 in US)

...and Then, how much of that is actual no-kidding well trained and maintained PPDs. My guess a very small percent of the whole but no way to be sure, is there?

I guess if you are a wealthy family with executive protection dog(s) costing 5-6 figures (see Svallin in MT, for example) you arent gonna advertise on FakeBook, IG or TikTok...

Sort of defeats the purpose.
 
My impression of the video - it is the only one I've seen produced by these particular people - looks more like staged stuff than real life. *To me*. I'm no expert but go back and look at the decoy "feeding the sleeve" - meaning he offers the sleeve to the dog, the dog doesn't demand it or try to take it in aggression. @Oh Little Oji has mentioned many times how sleeve trained dogs can become dependent upon the equipment and set-up. This dog barks, but looks pretty calm in the sit and bark and is not in hard drive if you ask me. Overall, yes, he might scare off someone, but stats say over 95% of would-be thieves go a different direction at the prospect of ANY dog. Personal protection involves high pressure put on a dog where it will prove to stay its ground. I see very little pressure in the training of the dog in this video.
 
Oh Little Oji said:
That's the Animal Watch woman. I have seen a vid on Dobes that she did, and I wonder if this is it.

I enjoy watching her vids pretty well, but I find they are not, well let's say they don't seem to have quite the level of information that we share around here at DCF.

I do know that she feels she must get her anti-cropping comments in.
Click to expand...
Have not watched yet, but had to laugh, as she was not hesitant to crop her neckline! (Sorry, had to🙄😂)
 
Ravenbird said:
My impression of the video - it is the only one I've seen produced by these particular people - looks more like staged stuff than real life. *To me*. I'm no expert but go back and look at the decoy "feeding the sleeve" - meaning he offers the sleeve to the dog, the dog doesn't demand it or try to take it in aggression. @Oh Little Oji has mentioned many times how sleeve trained dogs can become dependent upon the equipment and set-up. This dog barks, but looks pretty calm in the sit and bark and is not in hard drive if you ask me. Overall, yes, he might scare off someone, but stats say over 95% of would-be thieves go a different direction at the prospect of ANY dog. Personal protection involves high pressure put on a dog where it will prove to stay its ground. I see very little pressure in the training of the dog in this video.
Click to expand...
TY, insightful.
 
The video that started this thread reminded me of another Animal Watch video I had seen, where they were at an outfit called Protection Dogs Worldwide. I thought she very politely asked about reasons for ear cropping and docking, and the answers the trainer gave were ones I had never heard, but they were very good. It's at about 7:35 in the video, if anyone wants to just cut to it. Otherwise, I enjoyed the full video.
 
Katyusharocket said:
The video that started this thread reminded me of another Animal Watch video I had seen, where they were at an outfit called Protection Dogs Worldwide. I thought she very politely asked about reasons for ear cropping and docking, and the answers the trainer gave were ones I had never heard, but they were very good. It's at about 7:35 in the video, if anyone wants to just cut to it. Otherwise, I enjoyed the full video.
Click to expand...
I recall reading somewhere that tail docking between 3-5 days old is best; the nerve sheath is not complete and thus painless, but after 12-14 days it is and so its more like a surgical amputation with possibility of "forever ghost limb pain".
Given the tail is so fragile an active adult might break it multiple times if out and about doing adventurous things.

Ear blistering at ends...hmm thats a new one but makes sense, given how thin the "leathers" are, and risk of injury in rough play.
 
BG1 said:
I recall reading somewhere that tail docking between 3-5 days old is best; the nerve sheath is not complete and thus painless,
Click to expand...
this part I had heard before, maybe somewhere here...?
I took Katyusha's litter to the vet to have the 8 tail docks done at 3 days, and I can tell you there was only one pissed off puppy in the whole gang, (it was Katyusha, and she was pissed off before the docking, and thru it, and after it, until she got back to her momma to eat, then she was fine) otherwise not a peep, so I am a believer in this.
BG1 said:
but after 12-14 days it is and so its more like a surgical amputation with possibility of "forever ghost limb pain".
Click to expand...
this is the first I am reading this, but it seems legit from a layman's standpoint. Thanks for sharing.
BG1 said:
"Is it real or is it Memorex"
Click to expand...
absolutely hilarious! :rofl:
 
Ravenbird said:
looks more like staged stuff than real life. *To me*. I'm no expert but go back and look at the decoy "feeding the sleeve" - meaning he offers the sleeve to the dog, the dog doesn't demand it or try to take it in aggression. @Oh Little Oji has mentioned many times how sleeve trained dogs can become dependent upon the equipment and set-up.
Click to expand...
I notice this too, in this video and others. I know next to nothing about this*, but I too can see that dogs are being fed sleeves, in really artificial scenarios.

I watched show (I wanna say on NatGeo, more than 10yrs ago) that followed people that ran a PPD training business. They had a client picking up her dog, and they demoed his skills for her. Sorta. The trainer handled the dog, and the client just walked alongside. They were confronted by a decoy, who was known to the dog, with an agitator and a visible sleeve. I think that the handler knew when the decoy would appear. Based on my reading, the whole thing felt like they showed the client a neat trick the dog does -- he bites the crap out of sleeves. She was told that she had the rough equivalent of a police K9.

I know its tv and they don't show everything, but from what I could see; they gave her no training on handling the animal. They also didn't seem to impress that its a GSD, and not a human bodyguard who acts alone. They kind of just showed her his trick (him on the sleeve kinda freaked her out, seems like taking possession of the dog shouldn't be the first time she sees a dog working), handed her the leash, and sent her on her way. The whole thing felt very shady, I don't think that she purchased the PPD she was sold. Whether it was even the right thing for her situation in the first place is a separate question.

These people on AW remind me of this, they seem like they're putting on a good show and selling people that they need something that they probably don't.



*read the book Manstopper a few times and his set up of scenarios has significant differences than most videos I've seen.
 
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