Skin issues

[Lilleman_Blu]

hello my peoples! So I have some questions maybe someone can help… I have a blue dobie and he’s about 3 months old now. And I have changed his food, I give him fish oil and coconut oil in his food everyday. But he still seems to be scratching and his skin seems to have a weird smell. Kinda almost like hay. And I also rub him down with coconut oil the best of my ability lol. When I go to pet him he seems to start scratching like I’m hitting the sweet spot just about everytime. Are there and supplements I should try or something else I can do to help him.?

 

[JanS]

I've never had a dilute but perhaps @GennyB could give you some tips.

We'd love to see some new photos of him.

 

[Lilleman_Blu]

He’s so precious

 

[JanS]

Aww he is and he has some big paws on him.

 

[Lilleman_Blu]

Yes! I think he’s gonna be a BIG boy

 

[GennyB]

hello my peoples! So I have some questions maybe someone can help… I have a blue dobie and he’s about 3 months old now. And I have changed his food, I give him fish oil and coconut oil in his food everyday. But he still seems to be scratching and his skin seems to have a weird smell. Kinda almost like hay. And I also rub him down with coconut oil the best of my ability lol. When I go to pet him he seems to start scratching like I’m hitting the sweet spot just about everytime. Are there and supplements I should try or something else I can do to help him.?

This sounds like a yeast infection. I would start with getting his gut right with a good quality pre/probiotic. I would bathe him with a antifungal shampoo and rinse REALLY well. Think you have the shampoo gone? Rinse again!
Next what are you feeding? Ingredients matters because corn and other fillers can feed a yeast infection. Obviously a raw diet is best because there aren't many carbs there! Yeast LOVES sugar and starch. I understand feeding raw is not for everyone. So you should feed a diet with a low carb count.
Try new things slowly and don't give up on them too soon. It can take a loooooong time to find answers. Just be patient and keeping trying to find the answer.

I can't say it enough! USE SUNSCREEN on him. Even with the best coat it will be thin compared to a black so his skin sholuld be protected. A nice gentle baby sunscreen should do wonders. Remember to do a patch test first!

 

[GennyB]

He’s so precious

He's adorable! What's his name?

 

[Lilleman_Blu]

This sounds like a yeast infection. I would start with getting his gut right with a good quality pre/probiotic. I would bathe him with a antifungal shampoo and rinse REALLY well. Think you have the shampoo gone? Rinse again!
Next what are you feeding? Ingredients matters because corn and other fillers can feed a yeast infection. Obviously a raw diet is best because there aren't many carbs there! Yeast LOVES sugar and starch. I understand feeding raw is not for everyone. So you should feed a diet with a low carb count.
Try new things slowly and don't give up on them too soon. It can take a loooooong time to find answers. Just be patient and keeping trying to find the answer.

I can't say it enough! USE SUNSCREEN on him. Even with the best coat it will be thin compared to a black so his skin sholuld be protected. A nice gentle baby sunscreen should do wonders. Remember to do a patch test first!

I’ll definitely try the shampoo! And I currently have on taste of the wild bison and venison. It’s grain free. And with the sunscreen testing, how will it look or how would I tell if it doesn’t work for him? I’ve never had to put sunscreen on a pup before.

 

[Lilleman_Blu]

He's adorable! What's his name?

Blu

 

[GennyB]

And with the sunscreen testing, how will it look or how would I tell if it doesn’t work for him?

He will actually burn like a human. They actually make sunscreen for dogs but it tends to be more expensive so a baby screenscreen works just fine. Baby sunscreens tend to less harsh with the ingredients in case he licks it.

I’ve never had to put sunscreen on a pup before.

I know it's kinda weird but worth it because sun exposure a real risk for dogs with a thinner coat.

 

[Lilleman_Blu]

OH wow! I learn something new everyday! thank you for everything.. so try the shampoo and sunscreen is on the list! is there any probiotic that has worked for your pups? I used to work at a pet store and have a good general knowledge of the supplements. just not sure what to get home exactly for his skin issues

 

[GennyB]

is there any probiotic that has worked for your pups?

I like to keep things simple so goat kefir is my go to.
I guess I should mention that I would switch from fish oil to krill oil. There is 2 big reasons why I say that. First fish oil for dogs got trendy a few years ago. Therefore so many companies jumped on the bandwagon so I just don't have confidence in the quality. Second, krill oil is absorbed easier so it a winner for me.

 

[JanS]

I guess I should mention that I would switch from fish oil to krill oil. There is 2 big reasons why I say that. First fish oil for dogs got trendy a few years ago. Therefore so many companies jumped on the bandwagon so I just don't have confidence in the quality. Second, krill oil is absorbed easier so it a winner for me.

I agree that krill oil seems to be much more effective for dogs and humans.

 

[BGpa]

I've read elsewhere that rubbing coconut oil or any other lotion on coat will just gum up hair follicles.
Dobe puppies have juvenile immune systems so skinbreaks or follicle irritations can easily be colonized by staph for dogs...then you have another problem...!

You are better off feeding the oil inside out, ie by good quality food, no more than 26% protein for dobe pups and

For coat just groom lightly with a soft horsehair brush in the direction the hair lies to spread the natural oil from coat to dry spots.

Bathing more than once a month will just dry coat out, leaving flaky and itchy.

Try a 1 part vinegar to 3-4 parts water mix in spray bottleto wet lightly then wipe off to restore skin ph.

If the ears smel like fritos its time for swimmers ear drops.

PS: grain free is not for dobes. There's a whole bunch of stuff on this to discuss but it comes down to taurine, which is defoicient in typical grain free foods that rely on legumes to boost protein.

Focus on finding good food and half your coat problems go away.

 

[GennyB]

I've read elsewhere that rubbing coconut oil or any other lotion on coat will just gum up hair follicles.

Would you try to find where you read that? I'd be interested in reading it myself. Curious to see what they say because I'd find that hard to believe about coconut oil. It has such a low melting point that it almost dissolves in your hand. I used it on my fawn girl and it just absorbed almost immediately

Bathing more than once a month will just dry coat out, leaving flaky and itchy.

Not trying to beat you up here but I bathe my dogs once a week with no problems at all. My dogs happen to live a life running lots of property with rivers and and ponds. Right now I just have Riley and gets gets super dirty every day so gets at minimum rised off. I think it's possible to bathe dogs as often as they need it. It all depends on a couple of factors, the shampoo being used and even the water you rinse in. People living with city water have chlorine and other drying additives that can dry out the skin and coat. Another problem is so many people don't get the coat rinsed well enough. The dried residue, especially if you use a shampoo with harsh detergents can also dry out the skin.
Another thing to consider is we are talking about a dilute here. In my experience it is important to keep them clean using a gentle shampoo and rinsing well. Dilutes can have a thing called CDA (color dilution alopecia) which is a hair follicle problem that cause hairs to break off at the skin.

Try a 1 part vinegar to 3-4 parts water mix in spray bottleto wet lightly then wipe off to restore skin ph.

This is a good idea but should come later after we get this issue cleared up. With skin problems we don't want to add too many changes at once. Adding things slowly and one at a times hels us know what works and what dosen't.
I keep a bottle in the tub to rinse Riley with because not only does it help clear any residue it's also a GREAT deodorizer!

 

[Lilleman_Blu]

Well as of right now I have been bathing him in Burt’s bees oatmeal shampoo. I do live within a small city limits, so I’m sure the water might have a slight factor. But definitely gonna start with the anti fungal shampoo and the krill oil for a bit and go from there. I was told by a vet that coconut oil with its natural melting point being so low that it would help his skin hold in moisture and help him not itch. But I would like to ready up more on that! I like to learn different things that could or could not help

 

[BGpa]

Would you try to find where you read that? I'd be interested in reading it myself. Curious to see what they say because I'd find that hard to believe about coconut oil. It has such a low melting point that it almost dissolves in your hand. I used it on my fawn girl and it just absorbed almost immediately

Not trying to beat you up here but I bathe my dogs once a week with no problems at all. My dogs happen to live a life running lots of property with rivers and and ponds. Right now I just have Riley and gets gets super dirty every day so gets at minimum rised off. I think it's possible to bathe dogs as often as they need it. It all depends on a couple of factors, the shampoo being used and even the water you rinse in. People living with city water have chlorine and other drying additives that can dry out the skin and coat. Another problem is so many people don't get the coat rinsed well enough. The dried residue, especially if you use a shampoo with harsh detergents can also dry out the skin.
Another thing to consider is we are talking about a dilute here. In my experience it is important to keep them clean using a gentle shampoo and rinsing well. Dilutes can have a thing called CDA (color dilution alopecia) which is a hair follicle problem that cause hairs to break off at the skin.


This is a good idea but should come later after we get this issue cleared up. With skin problems we don't want to add too many changes at once. Adding things slowly and one at a times hels us know what works and what dosen't.
I keep a bottle in the tub to rinse Riley with because not only does it help clear any residue it's also a GREAT deodorizer!

Pretty sure that bathing advice (and the vinegar rinse) comes from a notable poster on "another doberman webforum" with something like 60 years of show dogs including a fawn with reputed good skin health...

Not disputing yours, of course. I'm very interested in what knowledgeable dobe owners have to say, especially those who have bred them and raised multiple litters (am I correct in recollecting that about you @GennyB?

I agree there are a lot of factors at play- your water quality, ghe shampoo used, even the way you scrub- one poster somewhere I read (reddit? Fakebook? DCF or the other dobe forum?) made a common sense observation that rubbing vigourously against the grain tends to break hairs off? T/f?

So whatever I offer up here I am happy to say is only based on my dobe noob experience: 130 years ago that was so easy a keeper I've forgotten and the current BYB Bonnie NA/EU in pretty good health thanks to doing a LOT of homework here and elsewhere reading the archived wisdom going back 20 years- a gold mine of dobe owner wisdom... thanks @JanS
I especially value advice learned here at DCF as it comes from a different group of folks with a practical handson and down to earttn point of view, (if its ok for me to make that generalization?)

So remedies are like training advice-
Imho, try what works for the dog in front of you, including what vet says, whats out there online...the breeder, the dobe experienced vet tech, etc. and most especially the owners of dogs like yours...dilutes are not easy keepers, I understand.

I used to talk to everyone in the horse biz when daughter was in hunter-jumper, and learned something new everyday BSing in my broken spanish with the guy mucking stalls, pestering every trainer I met with dumb questions, the judges, horse acupuncturists you name it.... - and thanks to doing so with a brilliant farrier I'd cultivated just out of curiousity ...
saved us $thousands dodging a bullet on a purchase on a doped up horse because I asked for his advice...

boy howdy was the trainer pi$$ed that "we didnt buy that horse from her friend Penny"... got rid of that trainer later btw but that's another story...

Thanks for the reply! I appreciate you!

 

[GennyB]

I'm very interested in what knowledgeable dobe owners have to say, especially those who have bred them and raised multiple litters (am I correct in recollecting that about you @GennyB?

Not me! I've spent lots of time with a couple of different breeders but I have NO interest in breeding! Even though one of them tried really hard to mentor me so I could take over for her when she retired it was a NO for me. My heart is in helping the ones that need it. Yes it can be heartbreaking but it also the most rewarding so I'll keep at it.

 

[BGpa]

Not me! I've spent lots of time with a couple of different breeders but I have NO interest in breeding! Even though one of them tried really hard to mentor me so I could take over for her when she retired it was a NO for me. My heart is in helping the ones that need it. Yes it can be heartbreaking but it also the most rewarding so I'll keep at it.

Thanks @GennyB I read back a ways and see you are big in rescue. Thats a hard job but does so much good. Most of my dogs in 60+ years of having them in my life have been pound puppies, all "Good Dogs!". So thanks for all the good you do...

I raised a litter (well my parents did but I helped) all the way from at the birth, in puppy box, bottle feeding the extras, mucking the stall, selling all the pups,
on my very first heart dog's one and only litter- 11 puppies iirc. Big life lesson for a kid.

Being a good breeder nowadays is a labor of love and a really tough business to do well. Not for me, either, maybe in the next lifetime.

 

[Abner’s Dad]

Pretty sure that bathing advice (and the vinegar rinse) comes from a notable poster on "another doberman webforum" with something like 60 years of show dogs including a fawn with reputed good skin health...

Not disputing yours, of course. I'm very interested in what knowledgeable dobe owners have to say, especially those who have bred them and raised multiple litters (am I correct in recollecting that about you @GennyB?

I agree there are a lot of factors at play- your water quality, ghe shampoo used, even the way you scrub- one poster somewhere I read (reddit? Fakebook? DCF or the other dobe forum?) made a common sense observation that rubbing vigourously against the grain tends to break hairs off? T/f?

So whatever I offer up here I am happy to say is only based on my dobe noob experience: 130 years ago that was so easy a keeper I've forgotten and the current BYB Bonnie NA/EU in pretty good health thanks to doing a LOT of homework here and elsewhere reading the archived wisdom going back 20 years- a gold mine of dobe owner wisdom... thanks @JanS
I especially value advice learned here at DCF as it comes from a different group of folks with a practical handson and down to earttn point of view, (if its ok for me to make that generalization?)

So remedies are like training advice-
Imho, try what works for the dog in front of you, including what vet says, whats out there online...the breeder, the dobe experienced vet tech, etc. and most especially the owners of dogs like yours...dilutes are not easy keepers, I understand.

I used to talk to everyone in the horse biz when daughter was in hunter-jumper, and learned something new everyday BSing in my broken spanish with the guy mucking stalls, pestering every trainer I met with dumb questions, the judges, horse acupuncturists you name it.... - and thanks to doing so with a brilliant farrier I'd cultivated just out of curiousity ...
saved us $thousands dodging a bullet on a purchase on a doped up horse because I asked for his advice...

boy howdy was the trainer pi$$ed that "we didnt buy that horse from her friend Penny"... got rid of that trainer later btw but that's another story...

Thanks for the reply! I appreciate you!

I think I know who discussed the importance of not rubbing/drying against the grain of blues and fawns on another forum. She says their hair is more fragile and can break off at the folicle, causing more skin problems and hair loss. I don’t have first-hand experience because I’ve only had blacks and reds- however one was starting to thin on the top of his backside but then I realized it was from repeatedly rubbing on the crate as he entered and exited . I’ve used the diluted vinegar trick and regularly spray and wipe my Dobe- I’m in the “not frequent baths” camp- it keeps him clean and controls doggie odor. I’d be really careful with regularly bathing a dilute with skin issues.