Yeah, I would be fine with that!!!I'd want to teach my Dobe to catch and destroy.
Prepping for the CGCA and proofing general obedience
- Thread starter Rits
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I don't know if my question has to be in a new thread, but I am interested in how, technically, service dogs are taught to disobey in an emergency situation. I assume the individual dog has to be strong, independent to some degree obviously, and exceptionally(?) intelligent.
I'm not sure what you mean - disobey in what way?
To save their handler/owner's life.
I don't have expertise in this field, but I believe most service dogs are taught to DO a thing, no matter what. Like a guide for the blind, to step between the person and, say, a fast bicycle coming by. Can't remember which book I read, but it was quite fascinating and takes an enormous amount of training for any specialty service dogs. If you're referring to life-saving to do with that persons handicap, I think they try to cover all the bases of common causes that could cause that person harm or fatality and train the dog accordingly. If it is protection type life-saving from an attack, I don't think service dogs are trained that way at all. LOL, I may still not be answering the scenario you had in mind, but it's an interesting question!
Yes it's a whole science isn't it, even for those who specialize in it. But very interesting, like in the military as well, when the dog has to break a stay command or other.
Then there are those dogs who save a life spontaneously by making an independent decision. I imagine Asha could be one of those, but pray of course she will never have to!
OK, so back to training to exposure to real life - again, I'm not a a store or other "place", but at the class for behavior training where I frequently take Asha for exposure. Yesterday the teacher said "let's just let the dogs learn to sit and chill instead of DOing". And it's been stuck with me for 24 hours now. I live in a very remote area so I take Asha to town parks and classes to train in different environments. I didn't consider Tractor Supply "training", because no heeling or (very much) sit-stays or recalls - mostly just coming along with me and my cart and don't growl or bark, but sure enough, we are always moving & doing. But sit in public to just... sit in public? I can count on two or four fingers. This behavior class has advanced dog from 2 o'clock to 3 and beginner/new dogs from 3 to 4. No one from the first group left at 3 so by 3:15 or so there were like 12 dogs and 14 people. Just hanging out. Asha did this for nearly 2 hours. Sounds brutal, and it kinda was, but Sooooo needed, just what the Dr. ordered, and hard until it wasn't. Just try it sometime, it's a challenge. We did well, eventually Asha just laid flat out. Being in place is exhausting.
Rits
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Awesome! Hey yeah amazing how just letting them exist is great training. And it's needed, honestly. We did that in our CGCA class and were strongly encouraged to work on this every week at least once. No commands. Just let them do whatever it is they are going to do and reward the good behaviors. It's why Ripley settles fairly quickly in places (like the vet pic earlier). That pic wasnt shocking for her at all. She did it on the day of CGCA eval too. Got so bored waiting around so she groaned and laid flat on her side like Asha. 
"Wake me up when we are doing something cool."
Notice a theme? She wasn't told to lay down in any of these. It's so dramatic looking though and gets lots of chuckles from people.
So good for them to learn to calmly "be" and not always moving.
"Wake me up when we are doing something cool."Notice a theme? She wasn't told to lay down in any of these. It's so dramatic looking though and gets lots of chuckles from people.
So good for them to learn to calmly "be" and not always moving.
I've been frustrated several times that I can put a down-stay on with no problem, but I can't "make" her relax. Really relaxing in public doesn't come easy for Asha, but it's getting better. It's not easy for ME to say let's drive to town (30 min. trip each way) and go just sit somewhere. I love to do nothing at home, but I don't want to drive somewhere to do nothing! LOL. Anything for the dog though.
Rits
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I get it! The "relax" has to not only be captured in split seconds and small doses and then rewarded but also simply more exposure, more acclimating to environments. It's a lot of work. Asha's first sign of relax probably won't even be super obvious either. Maybe less whining, less scanning, a sigh, eventual soft blinks. I imagine it took her a while to choose to lay down on her own like that!
Asha probably doesn't want to either
but it's good for her!
LifeofRubie
Moderator
We got to practice being good relaxed doggo's today at the Donut Shop!
I have a blanket that I put in the corner for them. They both know "On," similar to "place," and only get donuts when they're "on" the blanket.
Moo usually settles in a bit quicker than Rubie but once she's sniffed out the area, she'll get comfortable.
And when the sun hits just right....
I have a blanket that I put in the corner for them. They both know "On," similar to "place," and only get donuts when they're "on" the blanket.
Moo usually settles in a bit quicker than Rubie but once she's sniffed out the area, she'll get comfortable.
And when the sun hits just right....
bomary
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okaygreatthanks
Member
We're working on Remy's CGC right now, and this is the one test item I don't have confidence in ("reaction to another dog"). Remy does get fixated on other dogs, is extremely interested in greeting them, pulling towards them, and sometimes gives a play bark (which I recognize as such, but it's scary to other people).he want's to try and make friends with every other doggo we see (leash proactive? hahaha)Luckily he's pretty easy to reel in; doesn't get too fixated.
Treats/toys aren't always motivating enough to recapture his attention currently, so I probably need to have him on the prong only while proofing his training and leash reactivity in public for a while, even though I've been avoiding it since it's not permitted for the test.
We'll get there eventually, I hope!
I love that you're working on CGC! Mine was dog & people reactive when I did this test and I just did lots and lots of short work leading by dogs & people she knew and treating like crazy. If you have a class with people & dogs just pass back & forth until everyone is bored!
You've taught "leave it"? Use that command the instant he gets fixated. The INSTANT he holds a stare for more than 2 seconds is fixation, that's when to correct (little leash pop to get his attention, "leave it", and keep walking). If you wait 5 seconds his adrenaline has already shot up and now you are having to shut down drive instead of just a stare. My mistake was thinking my puppy had learned and I wanted to give her the opportunity to show me without correction that she could look away and come with me on her own. But in 3 seconds it had gone from staring to lunging. So after many failures, I just started correcting her for staring. When she learned (finally) that staring was really not the thing to do the lunging and explosive barking was reduced drastically. Nip it in the bud, so to speak. Stopping it before the real problem starts is the best way to end it.
You can do this! Keep working on it & let us know when your test comes up!
You've taught "leave it"? Use that command the instant he gets fixated. The INSTANT he holds a stare for more than 2 seconds is fixation, that's when to correct (little leash pop to get his attention, "leave it", and keep walking). If you wait 5 seconds his adrenaline has already shot up and now you are having to shut down drive instead of just a stare. My mistake was thinking my puppy had learned and I wanted to give her the opportunity to show me without correction that she could look away and come with me on her own. But in 3 seconds it had gone from staring to lunging. So after many failures, I just started correcting her for staring. When she learned (finally) that staring was really not the thing to do the lunging and explosive barking was reduced drastically. Nip it in the bud, so to speak. Stopping it before the real problem starts is the best way to end it.
You can do this! Keep working on it & let us know when your test comes up!
This is something I've had to work on with Olive too since she thinks every dog is going to like her. That's not the case with many of them and she needs to learn that sooner than later.
Rits
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I laugh reacted cause that was baby Ripley's issue. A social butterfly! A few well trusted dogs that have corrected her may have helped but she's so strong forward in personality it didn't really phase her too much.
@okaygreatthanks A good strong leave it works great along with (in practice) rewarding looking at your face when a distraction goes by. The key for that is to work on it with as much distance as your dog needs, and start with low level distractions, so that the distraction isn't above your dog's arousal threshold. Have a nice healthy mix of correction and reward for training. You can talk to them as much as possible during evaluation and that is really powerful too.
okaygreatthanks
Member
This is such great advice, thank you so much! His “leave it” command is *mostly* reliable (we work on it and impulse control daily since he’s a testy teen
), so I’ll start incorporating that as soon as he takes notice and staring.I’d been trying to engage his attention when dogs approach with “watch me” and rewarding when he looks away from the dog and makes eye contact with me, but then he goes right back to staring at them, and you’re exactly right about it escalating to lunging from there. “Leave it” is more definitive in letting him know what action I expect.
okaygreatthanks
Member
I’m so glad I’m not alone in this…makes me feel better that it’s a work in progress even for experienced Doberman owners.
okaygreatthanks
Member
Absolutely, distance when possible is super helpful right now. He did well at Lowe’s earlier today when another dog passed by the aisle we were on, and even maintained a down-stay, so he got jackpotted for that since it’s a pretty distracting environment.
Sometimes he surprises me with shining in (what I’d deem to be) more chaotic scenarios but then he’ll act like an extroverted maniac when he sees a dog on our daily neighborhood walk. He likes to keep me guessing lol.
