Needing to nip pulling in the bud... too early?

[StateOfMine]

Flint is starting to pull on the leash hard. I am honestly torn between "Oh, he is a 3.5 month old puppy and he is just excited. No big deal, I can correct when he is older and knows a little more about the world." and "Stop it immediately because this is going to be very hard to correct when he is more powerful than me." I am leaning more and more toward the latter way of thinking, though not without some guilt. I'd compare going out and exploring with me to the equivalent of a kid at Disneyworld for the first time. Yes he needs to learn to stay by me, but I can't blame him for being so excited about new things and places.

So I know he is way too young for prong or e-collars (I do know how to use both appropriately), I know that harnesses are absolutely horrible for training including the "no-pull" harnesses because they cause early onset of arthritis. What about a martingale collar? It's like a choke chain/flat collar hybrid, so my (perhaps incorrect) logic was that maybe I could use that for a softer correction on walks than a choke chain or anything more hardcore than that while he is still so little. I know about gentle leaders too but I have seen them rub some dogs' noses raw and I don't want to see that happen to Flint.

How should I handle a 3.5 month old doberpup that pulls on the leash like he's a working dog on a mission? Soon enough Flint... soon. I just need you to behave for now though.

 

[Doberman Gang]

Teach leash pressure, teaching the dog to give to pressure vs. fight against it. I typically start this very early as a puppy. But many people in my class learn to teach this when the dog is 6 months or older.
Here is a great explanation from Micheal Ellis

 

[Ravenbird]

Teach leash pressure, teaching the dog to give to pressure vs. fight against it. I typically start this very early as a puppy. But many people in my class learn to teach this when the dog is 6 months or older.
Here is a great explanation from Micheal Ellis

You always offer the best advice, where have you been lately!?

 

[Oh Little Oji]

While 14 weeks is very young, I would start working on heel. I start that pretty much right away with a pup. This is not to say that you have them on a heel at all times when on a walk. No, I believe in making a very very clear distinction between when the dog is on a heel and when it is not.

Have your dog work on heeling for part of the walk (probably a rather short portion of the walk at this age) and let them pull the rest of the time.

I know some will disagree with me and say that you should never let the dog pull because it shows them they are the leader; but it has worked for me over the years. Just make sure you make it perfectly clear when the dog is on a heel and when he is not. I don't even let my dogs walk on my left side, or pass by my left side when not on a heel. If they do, I just utter the work "ok" or "go" to make it clear that they are not semi-heeling and just choosing when to break a heel.

As for method of teaching the heel? The old book The Koehler Method of Dog Training literally saved my sanity back with my first Doberman. Nothing else worked. Oh, and yes, Dobermans are extreme pullers!!!

 

[Oh Little Oji]

I will add to my above endorsement of the Koehler Method that I add praise and a "Good heel" when the dog is getting it right. (I use another word, not "heel" but whatever you choose, stick with it) I also use treats to reward them for success and compliance in the heel. This, in addition to the negative consequences you provide them for breaking the heel. Read the book. I just use more positive than I remember William Koehler instructing. An appropriate mix of positive and negative is always the way to go.

 

[Ddski5]

A choke collar or martingale did not work for me. Just coughed and choked him. Also tried leash pressure, did not work either- granted I prob was not doing it correctly. I battle with leash pressure and doing 180’s until I finally gave in at 5 months and got a prong- The absolute game changer was a prong collar- like night and day.

 

[Kswoodssue]

I had the same experience as @Ddski5 . While she will stick like glue to my side off leash at home, she still pulls. That said, she is much better with age.

 

[Rits]

I've always done leash pressure training with mine but you have to start this at home and not when you are trying to walk. Then once they have the concept of leash pressure training and are old enough the prong comes in to backup the training.

 

[remy]

I've always done leash pressure training with mine but you have to start this at home and not when you are trying to walk. Then once they have the concept of leash pressure training and are old enough the prong comes in to backup the training.

Yes, definitely start at home! You can even practice inside the house first then move to the backyard. Don’t practice in a new place or even a familiar place with a lot of distractions yet, work your way up to it.

 

[Oh Little Oji]

I don't know what leash pressure training is, but I was going to come back here and follow up my prior posts to tell you about the "go slow" command.

It's a higher level skill than heeling, in my opinion, and it can take a Dobe a couple years to get it. Maybe with a more advanced training technique it could happen faster.

Basically, after the dog knows heel, and you've built a good foundation of obedience in general, you can get the dog to walk without putting any tension on the leash. The dog is not on a heel, but again, no tension is allowed on the leash.

Now that I currently own a different breed (not a Doberman this time around) amazingly, my puppy has been able to follow the "go slow" command as far back as about 6 months of age!

 

[Ravenbird]

I had the same experience as @Ddski5 . While she will stick like glue to my side off leash at home, she still pulls. That said, she is much better with age.

Same. My obedience off leash almost always looks better than leashed. If there's a leash she wants to lean on it. Much better with age, yes, but still...

 

[MichiH]

Are harness bad to use for puppy and so on?
Not sure what to use on Pepper now. She is 10 weeks used a harness to be saw this and stopped. Have a dinky collar, but she really will refuse to walk.
Choker chains still used? Clearly not to yank on it, but what’s the best to use?

 

[Ddski5]

Are harness bad to use for puppy and so on?
Not sure what to use on Pepper now. She is 10 weeks used a harness to be saw this and stopped. Have a dinky collar, but she really will refuse to walk.
Choker chains still used? Clearly not to yank on it, but what’s the best to use?

I would not use a harness.
A simple flat collar is fine.

At 10 weeks?
Not that you would but I would not force Pepper to do anything she wouldn’t want to do..you really kinda have to manipulate the situation with food lure and play to get her to do what you want.

You want her to walk with you? Don’t feed her breakfast or lunch and use that food for treating during training of the day. Throw food out there and walk with her to it. Or use a 25’ long leash- engage in play, then throw her food out there and when she gets it be excited and animated- when she comes back to you feed/treat her again. You are really working on eye contact and pleasurable engagement.

 

[MichiH]

I would not use a harness.
A simple flat collar is fine.

At 10 weeks?
Not that you would but I would not force Pepper to do anything she wouldn’t want to do..you really kinda have to manipulate the situation with food lure and play to get her to do what you want.

You want her to walk with you? Don’t feed her breakfast or lunch and use that food for treating during training of the day. Throw food out there and walk with her to it. Or use a 25’ long leash- engage in play, then throw her food out there and when she gets it be excited and animated- when she comes back to you feed/treat her again. You are really working on eye contact and pleasurable engagement.

Good ideas and thank you. I started the flat collar yesterday. We do the leash to go outside and use bathroom and play.

I’ll do her lunch outside tomorrow. Thank you!

 

[Ravenbird]

Harnesses were literally invented so horses could pull loads. They make it as comfortable as possible for the animal to lean into the chest piece and drag what's behind them. Dobermans will definitely take advantage of this, so no harness for walking. I use one for nose work training and trialing, but it is only used as a cue that "we are doing NW now, nothing else", and also I never ever let her go potty while it's on because that is an immediate DQ in trial. She learned that and also the difference between the lightweight nylon NW harness and the heavy leather harness we used to teach bite work. Just saying I'm not against harnesses if they are used with a purpose!

 

[JanS]

Harnesses were literally invented so horses could pull loads.

And sled dogs to give them more oomph to pull.

 

[Rits]

At this age I would focus on engagement through play and teaching her the correct position of where to walk (beside you) through luring. If you do this, the leash or tool you walk her on will never matter.

 

[Oh Little Oji]

Are harness bad to use for puppy and so on?
Not sure what to use on Pepper now. She is 10 weeks used a harness to be saw this and stopped. Have a dinky collar, but she really will refuse to walk.
Choker chains still used? Clearly not to yank on it, but what’s the best to use?

I agree that training is going to be your most powerful tool.

As for collars: I have never stopped using a choke collar. I know they have fallen out of favor both with people who know (or seem to know) their stuff, and with the clueless general public. A choke collar is fine though. I use a fur saver choke collar because it looks a lot better to me than the good old chokers you can find in the supermarket. Now that I own a different type of dog that actually has a medium/long coat, the fur saver is really a plus.

In addition to the reasons for a harness stated above, with Dobes, I always switched to a harness once the dog was about 2 - 3 years old and nice and trained. The reason is that Dobes' necks are long and elegant and more prone to spinal injury than some other breeds, especially since Dobes are powerful and explosive despite having the elegant neck. So yeah, I would not use a harness at this point at all. I know a harness is the thing that good ol' general public favors these days as it seems more "humane" to them than a collar; but never mind that stuff.

 

[MichiH]

Once again thank you all for the informative feedback and advice!

 

[Kswoodssue]

It is my experience that Dobermans have to WANT to comply. Learning a task is easy. Being consistent is another ballgame. …Listen to the folks above. Become the center of the universe for your pup. My only advice for leash walking, other than above, is make sure when your pup is big and strong that you always use whatever tool it takes to keep them safely in your control in public. Relax and have fun!