Crate training!!! Is this counterproductive?

[JustJon]

Hey Doberman Fam!

So Vito is doing really good in his crate, the first night he cried and whined for about 2 hours… I had to learn what was him just being “Bratty” and what is serious and a need to go out to relieve himself. I feel like I’m learning and am gaining confidence in being able to differentiate the two. He now has a bratty moment for 20 mins tops when he’s crated, if that! There are times he will go in and just lay down and fall asleep!

With all that being said; He sometimes naps out in the open… in the livingroom, the man cave, most times at my or my baby girls feet or laps. While it’s certainly the cutest thing, I’m not sure if it’s counterproductive and will have an adverse effect on crate training? Is it ok to let him sometimes nap out of his crate, or should I continue with redirecting him to his crate once he goes down for a nap?

 

[LifeofRubie]

I would say that it's not counterintuitive if he naps outside his crate.

Our crates are in our bedroom so it wasn't always feasible for our dogs to take every nap in their crates as puppies.

More importantly, it's great that he can put himself down and relax where hustle and bustle happens and in his crate. It shouldn't always be go go go when he's out of his crate.

The only caveat I can think of is that he most likely needs to go right outside when he wakes up from his naps to help with potty training. As long as he's not waking up unsupervised and having accidents in the house or getting in to trouble, let him nap away!

 

[Rits]

Whatever works for you! But I agree, with potty training and me personally not always having my eyes on my puppy 24/7, I'd scoop them up and put them in their crate. That way when they woke up and have to go potty, well they would learn to hold it and learn to let me know they had to go via whining because they don't want to soil their bed! Where if they were loose, they might just wander off and potty somewhere. Once potty trained I let mine nap wherever.

 

[Kswoodssue]

I most often crated when I felt she NEEDED a nap, or when I needed a break as well. “Needed” meaning she was going faster and faster, acting out just like toddlers do when they have had a nap deficiency. Otherwise when she slept, I just said a thank you prayer and kept moving.

 

[Ddski5]

IMHO- it can can either way however you want it to. I let mine free reign during the day and I believe I set a daily schedule of when they would go in the crate for a nap.

I think it is okay, just make sure that when master says it’s time to go in the crate- then it’s time to go in the crate. No heckling or faltering- in your little arse goes.

Everything fun and pleasure-able needs to go through you and that includes freedom. If he whines at anytime….you must wait 5mins until he stops whining before you let him out. You want to eliminate whining?? this is a good way to start that process. You let him out with him whining and you are only reinforcing the whine.

have to becareful, as much as you love and care for him you must try not to humanize him. What’s it called? Tough love? tough love now makes it much easier in the future…but don’t be a militaristic disciplinarian. Must have fun with training.

 

[JanS]

I agree that letting him nap outside of the crate is fine if he's not getting into stuff. I want all of our pups crate trained but if they're chilled enough to nap somewhere else, I'm good with it.
Our first Doberman would not chill out of the crate for years and he actually asked to go in there when he was tired. His breeder poorly socialized him so he had a few anxiety issues that took extra time to work through.

 

[JustJon]

I would say that it's not counterintuitive if he naps outside his crate.

Our crates are in our bedroom so it wasn't always feasible for our dogs to take every nap in their crates as puppies.

More importantly, it's great that he can put himself down and relax where hustle and bustle happens and in his crate. It shouldn't always be go go go when he's out of his crate.

The only caveat I can think of is that he most likely needs to go right outside when he wakes up from his naps to help with potty training. As long as he's not waking up unsupervised and having accidents in the house or getting in to trouble, let him nap away!

Thanks for the feedback. We try to be consistent in taking him out as soon as he wakes up from a nap, so far he’s had few accidents in the house… fingers crossed it stays that way!

 

[JustJon]

Whatever works for you! But I agree, with potty training and me personally not always having my eyes on my puppy 24/7, I'd scoop them up and put them in their crate. That way when they woke up and have to go potty, well they would learn to hold it and learn to let me know they had to go via whining because they don't want to soil their bed! Where if they were loose, they might just wander off and potty somewhere. Once potty trained I let mine nap wherever.

Thanks for the response! I lean more towards crating him during nap and bedtime during potty training.

 

[JustJon]

I most often crated when I felt she NEEDED a nap, or when I needed a break as well. “Needed” meaning she was going faster and faster, acting out just like toddlers do when they have had a nap deficiency. Otherwise when she slept, I just said a thank you prayer and kept moving.

Lol! He’s starting to go “faster and faster” I let him run around the yard, and go for walks… however, I try not to push him too far on walks at this young age. We get some play time, and fun training time in, and it seems to tire him out pretty good!

 

[JustJon]

IMHO- it can can either way however you want it to. I let mine free reign during the day and I believe I set a daily schedule of when they would go in the crate for a nap.

I think it is okay, just make sure that when master says it’s time to go in the crate- then it’s time to go in the crate. No heckling or faltering- in your little arse goes.

Everything fun and pleasure-able needs to go through you and that includes freedom. If he whines at anytime….you must wait 5mins until he stops whining before you let him out. You want to eliminate whining?? this is a good way to start that process. You let him out with him whining and you are only reinforcing the whine.

have to becareful, as much as you love and care for him you must try not to humanize him. What’s it called? Tough love? tough love now makes it much easier in the future…but don’t be a militaristic disciplinarian. Must have fun with training.

Solid feedback (as are the other responses), we do have a daily schedule that we’ve been adhering to. I really appreciate the emphasis on positioning oneself as the “master”, at this puppy stage they’re so cute and cuddly it’s easy to negate the need to be the “master”. It’s a dance to lead but not be militarized in doing so. I will take all of what you said into account and apply it! Thanks

 

[JustJon]

I agree that letting him nap outside of the crate is fine if he's not getting into stuff. I want all of our pups crate trained but if they're chilled enough to nap somewhere else, I'm good with it.
Our first Doberman would not chill out of the crate for years and he actually asked to go in there when he was tired. His breeder poorly socialized him so he had a few anxiety issues that took extra time to work through.

Thanks Jan! I definitely want him crate trained, we have 2 young children and a couple of teenage boys. We supervise the all of the children’s time around and with the dog… especially the 2 young girls ages 4 and 6. Our 4 year old adores him, and sometimes thinks he’s a teddy bear, so far she overwhelmed him once with hugs and kisses which led him to find his way in his crate. I immediately recognized he had had “too much” and wanted away from this little person lol. I’m also working on socializing him, allowing him to meet people; family, the few friends we have and the nice dogs in the neighborhood

 

[Ddski5]

Your Doberman is going to be an awesome family protector and a loyal companion to you.

My first guy was more than a handful- my wife and daughters really questioned what I had brought home and there for awhile I did too. He was was an undisciplined beast.

Well, I was determined that he was not gonna be that unruly Doberman that the public points at and talks about. I worked/trained with Ragnar practically everyday after work. I saw zero progress, grew frustrated and worried I was failing. I stayed true to the mission and at about 13months old I started to see the discipline show from the daily obedience training we did. At about 15months, I really saw it kick in and I knew our hard work for nothing.

IMHO, he is absolute golden now and has turned into my dream Doberman. Such a beautiful majestic animal…you will be just as proud of yours if you put the work in.

 

[Rits]

I’m also working on socializing him, allowing him to meet people; family, the few friends we have and the nice dogs in the neighborhood

Meeting people is fine, I would focus more on rewarding him for looking at you when around people and other dogs. Maybe one in every 10 people he gets a command to "go visit". This helps them learn to be focused on you more than other people and then they wont be so distracted later in life. After all, you should be more rewarding! So good to go to a park, keep him on leash and just sit there with a pocket full of treats. He will look around and then eventually look at you, mark it "yes!" and reward. Reward every bit of eye contact. Same with dogs, they don't need to meet dogs to be socialized around them. There is a thread on socialization, I'll try to find it. I believe it is stickied.

Edit:

what exactly is socialization?

Hello all! Thank you so much for the help in the last post. As some as you know, I’m getting my first dobie in April! When Im doing reasearch on Dobermans socialization comes up a lot! A lot of people do a lot of different thing and it has me a little…overwhelmed? I know socialization is as it...

doberman-chat.com

Proper socialization for a puppy

 

[JanS]

I’m also working on socializing him, allowing him to meet people; family, the few friends we have and the nice dogs in the neighborhood

Just be careful about where you take him until he's fully vaccinated since Parvo is a nasty thing. Keeping on solid surfaces like pavement or sidewalks is fairly safe but it can live in things like grass, dirt or sand for years.

 

[EricA]

so far she overwhelmed him once with hugs and kisses which led him to find his way in his crate. I immediately recognized he had had “too much” and wanted away from this little person lol.

I had a zero tolerance policy when my boys were young about them messing with the Doberman when it was in the crate.

If I caught them anywhere near the crate while the dog was in there - They had a problem. (the boys not the dog)

For the exact reason that you describe... That crate is the 'safe place' for the dog to go so it can get away from those kids!

 

[CzarCzar]

Your Doberman is going to be an awesome family protector and a loyal companion to you.

My first guy was more than a handful- my wife and daughters really questioned what I had brought home and there for awhile I did too. He was was an undisciplined beast.

Well, I was determined that he was not gonna be that unruly Doberman that the public points at and talks about. I worked/trained with Ragnar practically everyday after work. I saw zero progress, grew frustrated and worried I was failing. I stayed true to the mission and at about 13months old I started to see the discipline show from the daily obedience training we did. At about 15months, I really saw it kick in and I knew our hard work for nothing.

IMHO, he is absolute golden now and has turned into my dream Doberman. Such a beautiful majestic animal…you will be just as proud of yours if you put the work in.

This brings me hope. My dog is almost five months and I have no idea if he is your average pup. He never sits still unless he is in the car. I thought I would be able to snuggle or love on him. He has never sat still and or not nipped once since I got him at 9 wks. I repeat and repeat and repeat! We have a trainer now who I like a lot. We made the mistake of signing a contract with Bark Busters. That’s another story but I’m grateful I knew a little on my own to train basic commands. Maybe not perfect but it was something. PS I have holes in all my pants. If one day it all pays off I will be very grateful to not be covered in muddy,ratty clothing and hands that have seen better days.