Dumbbell over the jump

Ravenbird

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Over a year ago I worked my arse off to get a good dumbbell retrieve. I was pretty pleased with it but it was one of the most patience-testing training things I've ever done with Asha. We both wanted it to go faster but I refused to skip steps. Then life happened, I was working on SAR stuff, dropped out of the thoughts of ever getting anywhere in IGP due to club distance, then more life happened and now it's June '23 and we haven't picked up a dumbbell since before December of last year. 4 days ago I picked it up and did a couple of tosses. It was so nice I thought, well, may as well start on the jump then. She went over the jump to get it but returned with it twice by going around not over. I stepped in really close to the jump as she was returning the 3rd time and ran backwards saying HUP! and she did! Big party and quit for the day. 2 more days with only 2 retrieves each, both as nice as I could expect and this is day 4. I am always amazed by this dog, but to have this kind of nice work in 4 days with never coming over a jump with a dumbbell, and being over 6 months since she even saw the dumbbell, sorry, I'm just a bit barn blind right now and love my girl.

I know it's not clean, tidy or perfect, and I have a lot to work on like not moving my feet and I need to measure where I stand and where I'm aiming to throw, and I backed up as she came to me, and I was so happy with her I didn't make her fix her finish, so all that needs work.
And the barrel is 21" and the 2 x 6 is on it's edge so that's only 26" tall - what's a meter, 40 inches??? I mean, this is not hard on her, but I'm looking at turning the barrel on it's end to make it a meter tall... that's a lot of jump.
And I'm out here videoing not thinking anything about what I'm wearing because I'm doing this to review training, not to publish... LOL, but then you get to a certain age and run our of those %!#@'s to give and publish it anyway.



screenshots are crummy, and now I can't remember how I got clear stills of videos a year or two ago. But here's a still from the video

fullsizeoutput_68c.jpeg
 
Awesome awesome work! I had to laugh at her paw slap/slide into the dumbbell. Totally something Ripley would do. Beautiful front on the return!

What size dumbbell do you use/where did you order it? I need to start training Ripley on the retrieve for something challenging/fun to start working on.
 
What size dumbbell do you use/where did you order it? I need to start training Ripley on the retrieve for something challenging/fun to start working on.
This is IGP regulation, the smallest one. It's about 1 1/2 lbs. I think AKC has gone mostly to plastic ones now, they're like feathers compared to this honker. 😅



I think RayAllen sells the AKC ones too, if not J & J sells them - they are one company now I think. I don't know what regulations are for AKC, but @obbanner would. Maybe the same size/weight throughout the levels? Same for Rally & Ob? I don't know.

This was a 100% shaped retrieve, meaning no commands, no corrections, click & food only. Probably took 3 - 4 months, and you start with PVC pipe - there's reasons! - which Asha thought was torture. I'm sure a few of my videos are on here, I was going to tack this one on to that thread, but was too lazy to look for it last night.
 
Over a year ago I worked my arse off to get a good dumbbell retrieve. I was pretty pleased with it but it was one of the most patience-testing training things I've ever done with Asha. We both wanted it to go faster but I refused to skip steps. Then life happened, I was working on SAR stuff, dropped out of the thoughts of ever getting anywhere in IGP due to club distance, then more life happened and now it's June '23 and we haven't picked up a dumbbell since before December of last year. 4 days ago I picked it up and did a couple of tosses. It was so nice I thought, well, may as well start on the jump then. She went over the jump to get it but returned with it twice by going around not over. I stepped in really close to the jump as she was returning the 3rd time and ran backwards saying HUP! and she did! Big party and quit for the day. 2 more days with only 2 retrieves each, both as nice as I could expect and this is day 4. I am always amazed by this dog, but to have this kind of nice work in 4 days with never coming over a jump with a dumbbell, and being over 6 months since she even saw the dumbbell, sorry, I'm just a bit barn blind right now and love my girl.

I know it's not clean, tidy or perfect, and I have a lot to work on like not moving my feet and I need to measure where I stand and where I'm aiming to throw, and I backed up as she came to me, and I was so happy with her I didn't make her fix her finish, so all that needs work.
And the barrel is 21" and the 2 x 6 is on it's edge so that's only 26" tall - what's a meter, 40 inches??? I mean, this is not hard on her, but I'm looking at turning the barrel on it's end to make it a meter tall... that's a lot of jump.
And I'm out here videoing not thinking anything about what I'm wearing because I'm doing this to review training, not to publish... LOL, but then you get to a certain age and run our of those %!#@'s to give and publish it anyway.



screenshots are crummy, and now I can't remember how I got clear stills of videos a year or two ago. But here's a still from the video

View attachment 135500
Very nice, I like the speed out and back. Couple of things for you,
1- I would start at least one step farther back so she doesn’t crash you when she returns I typically stand at 6 meters instead of 5 due to the same problem.
2- make sure you say bring when she is jumping. That command must be when she is in the air.
3- I would practice having her retrieve the dumbell on the flat with the dumbbell in front of a wall or object to teach picking it with out hitting with front feet. Kicking the dumbbell with cost points in competition.
Sorry I don’t want to sound too critical you are doing an awesome job, just small details you can easily fix that will save you some points Later.
 
Great job! Very good video. We should all video training. Because you will see something's you are automatically doing from training that you shouldn't do in a trial. In training we do lots of things because its training, but it just becomes automatic from muscle memory.

Yes, back up some as @Doberman Gang mentioned. She doesn't have enough room to slow down and stop and bumps you. In a trial they will mark a line. You can be farther back than the line.

Also, not to be critical. If you're going to finish her, make sure she does a good complete finish. Then reward.
I think if they bump into you might get a point off or more if they bump you and you move your feet.

We always in practice first walk over to the jump and wall have Arson jump over a couple of times over and back without the dumbbell.

Our biggest issue is. On retrieving the dumbbell when he comes in close to front, he backs up a little then sits. But he's still less than a foot away from me. I've tried lots of things to correct this to get him closer. He's good at the retrieve on flat, wall and jump. Just the distance of the front.

But this doesn't happen when I call him from the walking Down. He comes in nice and close.
:pullhair:
 
This is IGP regulation, the smallest one. It's about 1 1/2 lbs. I think AKC has gone mostly to plastic ones now, they're like feathers compared to this honker. 😅



I think RayAllen sells the AKC ones too, if not J & J sells them - they are one company now I think. I don't know what regulations are for AKC, but @obbanner would. Maybe the same size/weight throughout the levels? Same for Rally & Ob? I don't know.

This was a 100% shaped retrieve, meaning no commands, no corrections, click & food only. Probably took 3 - 4 months, and you start with PVC pipe - there's reasons! - which Asha thought was torture. I'm sure a few of my videos are on here, I was going to tack this one on to that thread, but was too lazy to look for it last night.
I have to wait until I get home to answer. I don't remember seeing anything specific about dumbbells on the regulations. I remember being told to get a bar that's slightly wider than the dogs mouth so it's balanced properly.

I'm at the AKC Rally National Championships this weekend. Here's our first run.
Screenshot_20230616-093831_Video Player.jpg
 
Very nice, I like the speed out and back. Couple of things for you,
1- I would start at least one step farther back so she doesn’t crash you when she returns I typically stand at 6 meters instead of 5 due to the same problem.
2- make sure you say bring when she is jumping. That command must be when she is in the air.
3- I would practice having her retrieve the dumbell on the flat with the dumbbell in front of a wall or object to teach picking it with out hitting with front feet. Kicking the dumbbell with cost points in competition.
Sorry I don’t want to sound too critical you are doing an awesome job, just small details you can easily fix that will save you some points Later.
Great information, thank you! Yeah, I need to look at the rules and measure where I stand and where I need to throw the dumbbell to. She's got such an intense recall, always wanting to slam into me. I saw her coming with that chunk o' wood and automatically took a step back. 😅 Appreciate the tip! See, I'd watched that Arkansas trial and took note about "bring being said while they are airborne - then promptly forgot. I'll remember now. Good idea about the wall - I knew they don't want to see play antics, but didn't know what to do about it.

I post this stuff because I know I'll get some critique! Always tell me what you see/think!

Great job! Very good video. We should all video training. Because you will see something's you are automatically doing from training that you shouldn't do in a trial. In training we do lots of things because its training, but it just becomes automatic from muscle memory.

Yes, back up some as @Doberman Gang mentioned. She doesn't have enough room to slow down and stop and bumps you. In a trial they will mark a line. You can be farther back than the line.

Also, not to be critical. If you're going to finish her, make sure she does a good complete finish. Then reward.
I think if they bump into you might get a point off or more if they bump you and you move your feet.

We always in practice first walk over to the jump and wall have Arson jump over a couple of times over and back without the dumbbell.

Our biggest issue is. On retrieving the dumbbell when he comes in close to front, he backs up a little then sits. But he's still less than a foot away from me. I've tried lots of things to correct this to get him closer. He's good at the retrieve on flat, wall and jump. Just the distance of the front.

But this doesn't happen when I call him from the walking Down. He comes in nice and close.
:pullhair:
I have learned more by watching my own videos than anything. But then I don't have any weekly lessons or club time so I'm about all I've got. I do need to get her to finish smoother, in one motion instead of 2 or 3. I usually won't release her until she's proper, but this video I was so excited how well she did, I just said Whoopee! Any tips to get that flip finish sharpened up? It's half-ass like this about 50% of the time. I was advised that the go-around finish will never look bad and not to do the flip finish, but did I listen? Nope. :(

Thanks for the comments, I always appreciate the input!
 
Over a year ago I worked my arse off to get a good dumbbell retrieve. I was pretty pleased with it but it was one of the most patience-testing training things I've ever done with Asha. We both wanted it to go faster but I refused to skip steps. Then life happened, I was working on SAR stuff, dropped out of the thoughts of ever getting anywhere in IGP due to club distance, then more life happened and now it's June '23 and we haven't picked up a dumbbell since before December of last year. 4 days ago I picked it up and did a couple of tosses. It was so nice I thought, well, may as well start on the jump then. She went over the jump to get it but returned with it twice by going around not over. I stepped in really close to the jump as she was returning the 3rd time and ran backwards saying HUP! and she did! Big party and quit for the day. 2 more days with only 2 retrieves each, both as nice as I could expect and this is day 4. I am always amazed by this dog, but to have this kind of nice work in 4 days with never coming over a jump with a dumbbell, and being over 6 months since she even saw the dumbbell, sorry, I'm just a bit barn blind right now and love my girl.

I know it's not clean, tidy or perfect, and I have a lot to work on like not moving my feet and I need to measure where I stand and where I'm aiming to throw, and I backed up as she came to me, and I was so happy with her I didn't make her fix her finish, so all that needs work.
And the barrel is 21" and the 2 x 6 is on it's edge so that's only 26" tall - what's a meter, 40 inches??? I mean, this is not hard on her, but I'm looking at turning the barrel on it's end to make it a meter tall... that's a lot of jump.
And I'm out here videoing not thinking anything about what I'm wearing because I'm doing this to review training, not to publish... LOL, but then you get to a certain age and run our of those %!#@'s to give and publish it anyway.



screenshots are crummy, and now I can't remember how I got clear stills of videos a year or two ago. But here's a still from the video

View attachment 135500
Had to laugh on your "Don't care what I am wearing". and you look FINE! That is where I am at these days....in jammy pants, posted training video online...don't care :tearsofjoy: That's a really nice video...and I love how she goes RIGHT over the barrel! She will definatley get the jump!
 
Great information, thank you! Yeah, I need to look at the rules and measure where I stand and where I need to throw the dumbbell to. She's got such an intense recall, always wanting to slam into me. I saw her coming with that chunk o' wood and automatically took a step back. 😅 Appreciate the tip! See, I'd watched that Arkansas trial and took note about "bring being said while they are airborne - then promptly forgot. I'll remember now. Good idea about the wall - I knew they don't want to see play antics, but didn't know what to do about it.

I post this stuff because I know I'll get some critique! Always tell me what you see/think!


I have learned more by watching my own videos than anything. But then I don't have any weekly lessons or club time so I'm about all I've got. I do need to get her to finish smoother, in one motion instead of 2 or 3. I usually won't release her until she's proper, but this video I was so excited how well she did, I just said Whoopee! Any tips to get that flip finish sharpened up? It's half-ass like this about 50% of the time. I was advised that the go-around finish will never look bad and not to do the flip finish, but did I listen? Nope. :(

Thanks for the comments, I always appreciate the input!
I don’t train finishes on recalls or retrieves. I want to focus the reward on the front and dumbbell hold. I also don’t want the dog to anticipate the finish. If I work finishes it will be just finishes. I start in heel position, say sit then turn in front. Then ask for a finish. Repeat multiple times rewarding full straight finishes. Usually do in a room with mirrors unless I have a spotter. No reward for crooked or slow finishes. Use a rising crop or pvc pipe to move dien to make sure butt gets around.
 
It gets sone looks from some but it doesn’t matter.
I love this. About where I am in attitude these days. 😅
I don’t train finishes on recalls or retrieves. I want to focus the reward on the front and dumbbell hold. I also don’t want the dog to anticipate the finish. If I work finishes it will be just finishes. I start in heel position, say sit then turn in front. Then ask for a finish. Repeat multiple times rewarding full straight finishes. Usually do in a room with mirrors unless I have a spotter. No reward for crooked or slow finishes. Use a rising crop or pvc pipe to move dien to make sure butt gets around.
I did front recalls when she was a pup and within a week of adding a finish to the front, she was not waiting in front, just front & finish in one movement. I had to do a month of fronts only and and another month of finish only and even today she wants to finish before being asked. Way thinking ahead type of dog. I have tiptoed around this problem for a couple of years now and try to not do too much in succession. Like you said, fronts only with no finish, but I haven't known how to work on finish only. Your tip is something I'll try.
 
I love this. About where I am in attitude these days. 😅

I did front recalls when she was a pup and within a week of adding a finish to the front, she was not waiting in front, just front & finish in one movement. I had to do a month of fronts only and and another month of finish only and even today she wants to finish before being asked. Way thinking ahead type of dog. I have tiptoed around this problem for a couple of years now and try to not do too much in succession. Like you said, fronts only with no finish, but I haven't known how to work on finish only. Your tip is something I'll try.
What I do now is cue my dog. When the dog comes in to front, with or without a dumbbell, I watch them in and as soon as they sit I look up as if I were looking at the judge. Count 3-5 seconds changing it randomly. Then look down to give the finish command. Now my cue is I only give a command when I look at you. If I am not looking at you you just remain in position.
 
What I do now is cue my dog. When the dog comes in to front, with or without a dumbbell, I watch them in and as soon as they sit I look up as if I were looking at the judge. Count 3-5 seconds changing it randomly. Then look down to give the finish command. Now my cue is I only give a command when I look at you. If I am not looking at you you just remain in position.
These types of things would be what you learn over time with a half-dozen dogs. And the types of things that could save a lot of back-peddling if you'd done it from the beginning! Thanks again, I'm taking notes!
 
I start in heel position, say sit then turn in front. Then ask for a finish. Repeat multiple times rewarding full straight finishes. Usually do in a room with mirrors unless I have a spotter. No reward for crooked or slow finishes. Use a rising crop or pvc pipe to move dien to make sure butt gets around.
I started working this a little bit in the house with a mirror and curious to know: If she finishes crooked or too far away, do you correct or just not reward? Reward after you correct the position? I have a long riding crop and I understand that it is not a "whip", just an extension of my arm to reach and tap her over to me, but she isn't very responsive to that. E-collar on vibrate will remind her to move into me and has been more helpful. Any caution against doing it that way? Really wanting to know about timing. I'm watching in the mirror and have been waiting for her choose the wrong place to sit before a reward or a "nope" and start over. If I want to correct her should I try to do so while she's still moving and I can see it's going to be crooked (try to help her get it right)? Or let her complete the wrong position and then fix it? It's always pretty fast, so I haven't tried to help her get it right in mid turn, afraid I'll make it worse.

Hot days lately - gotta have more little routines to work on inside!
 
I started working this a little bit in the house with a mirror and curious to know: If she finishes crooked or too far away, do you correct or just not reward? Reward after you correct the position? I have a long riding crop and I understand that it is not a "whip", just an extension of my arm to reach and tap her over to me, but she isn't very responsive to that. E-collar on vibrate will remind her to move into me and has been more helpful. Any caution against doing it that way? Really wanting to know about timing. I'm watching in the mirror and have been waiting for her choose the wrong place to sit before a reward or a "nope" and start over. If I want to correct her should I try to do so while she's still moving and I can see it's going to be crooked (try to help her get it right)? Or let her complete the wrong position and then fix it? It's always pretty fast, so I haven't tried to help her get it right in mid turn, afraid I'll make it worse.

Hot days lately - gotta have more little routines to work on inside!
Does she flip finish or go around? Sorry I couldn’t remember. If it is a flip I use the riding crop to tap them before the sit or stop moving. I also use electric so the quicker you get there and get straight the quicker I turn it off. Sounds horrible but I wouldn’t do that on just any dog. Softer dogs eoukd not need it. So make them be correct then I reward immediately if correct. If not correct no reward and do over.
 

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