Breeder in Maryland

I don't have any advice re this topic, however, you touched on an important detail with your min pin. Diet matters a lot to their overall health. Dobes do not have longevity on their side. Not to distract from your search, but one thing to note is that many of them have sensitive stomachs. When we got Kaiser I was going to have him on kibble. He is now a raw fed dog because his stool was almost never solid on kibble. Just something to consider. Now he has his own freezer and only has kibble in his treat balls.

I think you should create a thread for your min pin. He looks feisty! I'm happy that you've made the efforts to help him through this. That means you'll be ready for the demands of a Dobe pup.

Archer said:

I commend you for doing your research. Looked into the breeder. The Pedigree of the bitch alone would make me walk away as there is early cardiac death in multiple generations in a five generation pedigree, including a huge contributor to the disease. If you are still interested in this litter I strongly advise you talking to the breeder about her intention behind this particular breeding.

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Archer, what other dogs in this pedigree besides Blue were known for early cardiac deaths? When you state something you need to be prepared to back it up because this pedigree on the whole is a healthy one. Blue is in there one time, GCH Shadeko's Bringin' On The Heat CD, Tesla's mom and a Blue Daughter is right here next to me as I type this. Racyn is 7 and a half. Her Mom Rally, GCH Shadeko's When Dreams Come True CD is also sitting right here, she will be 11 next month. Rally's Mom Rainy, Shadeko's Over The Rainbow, died from an intestinal obstruction, she ate parts of a blanket with strings in it, we put her to sleep as I didn't want to put her through a complicated surgery at her age. (Almost 11). You can ask me about any of the dogs in Tesla's pedigree and I will tell you what I know. The bottom side of Tesla's pedigree is very healthy except for Blue dying of cardio at 7 and a half who is in there one time and he is 4th generation from the puppies. You show me a pedigree that doesn't have at least one dog that died of cardio in 4 or 5 generations. The ones I would stay away from are the ones doubling up on cardio, that's what, in my opinion, is asking for trouble. So please don't make statements about a dog's pedigree that's false. Thanks

Pat Reinhardt
Shadeko Dobermans

cuda567 said:

We are looking for a healthy, strong companion with good temperment and not necssarily a show dog
Please let me know your thoughts,

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Kalecho said:

When you state something you need to be prepared to back it up because this pedigree on the whole is a healthy one.

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And folks that’s what you get for expressing your opinion.

A new member came on and asked for assistance. Archer gave thoughts and continued educating new member.

Kalecho said:

You can ask me about any of the dogs in Tesla's pedigree and I will tell you what I know.

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It is not Archer that wants to know, it is Cuda567. And it’s apparent that some concerns and conversation were started between Cuda567 and you- that’s a good thing.

Sure, you prob feel like you have to defend your position, but could have came on here and did it differently.

When my pedigree is attacked it gets my hackles up, when things are said on a public forum that aren't true it gets me angry since I've been working on health and longevity for 25 years and at the same time trying to produce dogs who are conformationally correct. These were not just thoughts, they were statements attacking a pedigree saying it's not a healthy one. You bet I will defend my pedigree and my dogs as all of you should. No where did they say this was an opinion, it was stated as fact. I don't know how you would have done this differently, there was nothing rude nor offensive in my post.

Ddski5 said:

A new member came on and asked for assistance. Archer gave thoughts and continued educating new member.

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She has been a member since 2009, so really not a new member.
She just hasn’t been active in a while.

I did not read/receive the post in an attacking manner, but then it was not in reference to me and I mine. I would have dropped the retaliatory comments and just stated the facts. You stated the facts quite well by the way.

Tropicalbri's said:

She has been a member since 2009, so really not a new member.
She just hasn’t been active in a while.

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I was referring to Cuda567 being the new member seeking information.

Well, I guess we are Doberman people, and I have a theory that Doberman people are often sort of like the breed itself: Enthusiastic, Sometimes Defensive, Tenacious and Quirky. Then you have breeders, who tend to be psychotic. (see the winky face?)

Kalecho said:

Archer, what other dogs in this pedigree besides Blue were known for early cardiac deaths? When you state something you need to be prepared to back it up because this pedigree on the whole is a healthy one. Blue is in there one time, GCH Shadeko's Bringin' On The Heat CD, Tesla's mom and a Blue Daughter is right here next to me as I type this. Racyn is 7 and a half. Her Mom Rally, GCH Shadeko's When Dreams Come True CD is also sitting right here, she will be 11 next month. Rally's Mom Rainy, Shadeko's Over The Rainbow, died from an intestinal obstruction, she ate parts of a blanket with strings in it, we put her to sleep as I didn't want to put her through a complicated surgery at her age. (Almost 11). You can ask me about any of the dogs in Tesla's pedigree and I will tell you what I know. The bottom side of Tesla's pedigree is very healthy except for Blue dying of cardio at 7 and a half who is in there one time and he is 4th generation from the puppies. You show me a pedigree that doesn't have at least one dog that died of cardio in 4 or 5 generations. The ones I would stay away from are the ones doubling up on cardio, that's what, in my opinion, is asking for trouble. So please don't make statements about a dog's pedigree that's false. Thanks

Pat Reinhardt
Shadeko Dobermans

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Hi Pat,
What I am about to say, I say in full respect. You don't know me from Adam, nor do you know my experience or background. What you also don't know about me is I would never make a statement about something that was false, that I didn't thoroughly research. This is a public forum, yes...but we have rules here. One of which is calling out a member publicly or with disrespect. I honestly don't appreciate your comment as I was just sharing my opinion here to a member who asked for it. I was in no way disrespectful to you. I never in any was bashed you or "attacked your Pedigree", but shared my opinion both respectfully and professionally. I was asked for said opinion and I shared my educated thoughts. Pretty certain everyone is entitled to their opinion and doing so is in no way bashing. My apologies if sharing mine hurt feelings.

I did not go into details in my comment because this is not a breeder forum and I was sparing the details to others who may not want to read what I had to say. However, my lack of not including that information IN NO WAY had to do with it strictly being my opinion or it being a false statement. They are NOT just thoughts. It is quite proven that breeding DCM in a pedigree four generations back can still produce DCM. I don't feel I need to name off the Blue offspring that have died from sudden death via arrhythmic cardiomyopathy, which is what Blue passed away from (this is separate from DCM had and what many of his popular get passed away from). I don't feel I need to throw down names of the dogs in question, but Legato, Bella, Frankie, Glory and few of many who passed away the same way their Sire did. Gunner was just recently diagnosed with DCM. Also a Blue son. There are more I have not listed, and assumably more we don't even know about. With where we stand right know with our knowledge on the genetic aspect of DCM and how it is passed on, the advice from many known researchers is to not breed with prevalent DCM in a pedigree, and Blue was a prominent producer of cardiac disease. There are therefore dogs in Blue's pedigree behind him that passed the genetics on to Blue. That's how it works. I don't feel I need to get into the science behind that or name the dogs on that side of his pedigree, or even list references for my statements because a simple Google search will accomplish that. Until we really know more about DCM, it's genetic characteristics and isolate out more genes responsible for contributing towards the disease we need to breed away from it. Personally I don't feel that any pedigree that has cardio in it can be considered healthy. Especially one with a sire that throws dogs that pass away from cardiac related disease prior to turning 6. As Blue was a rightfully popular sire, he is in many pedigrees and I personally stay clear of any pedigree he is in. My original comment to the OP took what I have said above in consideration.

As far as showing you a pedigree that does not have cardio in four generations, I can show you several including my own. It's not as uncommon as people think.

I responded here out of respect towards you, but I ask that if you have any other issues with me, or any other member that you take them up respectfully in PMs and not blast an admin (or any member)in public. Also in no way did I disrespect your breeding program. This is in no way personal. All I stated was my opinion, which is what was asked.

Thank you .

Archer said this: The Pedigree of the bitch alone would make me walk away as there is early cardiac death in multiple generations in a five generation pedigree, including a huge contributor to the disease.



I did not blast anyone and didn't mean to, you're avoiding the fact that you said Multiple dogs in the pedigree have died from early cardiac death, which sounded like a fact, not an opinion and that is simply not true. I'm still waiting to hear who these dogs are. I'm just defending my breeding which any breeder would do. Not sure where you found my post offensive.

Yes I did answer that question. You just chose not to see or accept my answer as an answer. I also asked you to remain respectful and to not respond publicly like you did.

My apologies to the OP.